MONDAY: Now AFTRA has officially weighed in on the Interactive Contract and confirmed what SAG Interactive Committee chair Michael Bell told me — that AFTRA is starting informal negotiations on its own. Wheras in 2005 both AFTRA and SAG bargained the Interactive Contract jointly. See AFTRA’s statement below Bell’s…
SUNDAY: The Chair of the SAG Interactive Committee, Michael Bell, tells me that AFTRA is about to break with SAG on yet another previously jointly negotiated contract — this time the Interactive Contract affecting voice-overs. ”This has been disclosed to me by staff and discussed on Thursday by my committee. This particular email [below] is not SAG endorsed, however SAG will be sending out an email of their own regarding AFTRA’s meetings with the Interactive Producers and their obvious interest in negotiating without SAG. As a result, a notice from the guild will be going out to all its members (albeit targeting the voice-over community that works this contract), alerting them to a voice-over caucus on the subject. All will be welcomed to attend.” I haven’t heard back yet from AFTRA. Here’s the email which Bell has distributed:
ALERT TO THE VOICE-OVER COMMUNITY
“PLEASE FORWARD THIS TO EVERY VOICE-OVER ACTOR YOU KNOW”
It has come to the attention of the S.A.G. Interactive Committee, that AFTRA is about to negotiate the Interactive contract without the participation of S.A.G.
As you probably know, AFTRA and S.A.G. jointly bargained the Interactive Contract three years ago. Although the joint committees both agreed that RESIDUALS were the number one priority of the negotiations, the AFTRA committee members ultimately agreed to a contract with NO residuals. As a result, the S.A.G. committee members were left no choice but to accept the same terms.
In the three years since those negotiations, the Interactive industry has grown from $9 Billion dollars per year to $27 Billion dollars per year.
Also during that time, your S.A.G. Interactive Committee has been successful in organizing efforts that have turned a long time major non-union employer into a S.A.G. signatory with two huge projects in production.We have been informed that AFTRA claims to be holding Wages and Working Conditions meetings with Interactive actors in preparation for their negotiations (which are said to be imminent.)
We know for a fact that a majority of the top Interactive actors (those who record numerous games each year) know nothing about AFTRA’s present W&W meetings or AFTRA’s plans to go it alone in the upcoming Interactive contract negotiations.
Since AFTRA has not told the S.A.G. Interactive Committee anything about these negotiations, here are the questions all SAG actors that work that contract or expect to work that contract must ask:
1) Is AFTRA really holding Wages and Working Condition meetings with Interactive actors? And if actors are part of those meetings, who exactly has been invited?
2) What criteria did they use for their invitations?
3) Why have not all AFTRA members which are comprised mostly of VO talent been officially informed of these meetings?
4) Who is on the AFTRA committee that will be negotiating this contract?
5) What employers will be involved in these negotiations?
6) Why hasn’t AFTRA contacted S.A.G. to coordinate negotiations?
7) When are the AFTRA Interactive negotiations set to begin?
8) Are RESIDUALS part of AFTRA’s proposals?
9) And most importantly: Will AFTRA abandon RESIDUALS once again as they did three years ago?
You can write directly to the AFTRA Interactive negotiator Mathis Dunn.Please demand that AFTRA hold a caucus of the entire Interactive community of actors before beginning any negotiations.
Demand that AFTRA coordinate their negotiations with S.A.G. instead of de-leveraging S.A.G. as they did in the current TV/Theatrical negotiations.
Please send a copy of your correspondence to the S.A.G. Interactive Committee.IMPORTANT NOTE: The Interactive Contract is completely independent from the TV/Theatrical contract currently being negotiated by S.A.G. The outcome of those negotiations have absolutely nothing to do with the Interactive Contract. No job action, if any, will have anything to do with this contract.
In solidarity,
Michael Bell
S.A.G. Interactive Chair
Here is what AFTRA national president Roberta Reardon and AFTRA Interactive Steering Committee national chair Denny Delk responded on Monday to members:
We are preparing to address the AFTRA Interactive Agreement… The AFTRA Interactive Agreement has been in existence for two decades since AFTRA members first organized the area of interactive gaming to ensure that they, and the working performers that came after them, had the protection of union rates and conditions. AFTRA was the first performers’ union to organize and negotiate a collective bargaining agreement with Electronics Arts and since then AFTRA members have continued to expand union protections for performers working in this field. The Interactive Agreement is not now, nor has it ever been, a contract negotiated under the Phase One Agreement between AFTRA and SAG.
The current AFTRA Interactive Agreement is set to expire on December 31, 2008. In June 2008, the AFTRA National Board authorized the appointment of an Interactive Steering Committee (ISC) to guide strategic approaches for negotiations of the Interactive Agreement in 2008. In authorizing this Committee, the National Board was keenly aware that the Commercials Contracts expire on October 29, 2008, (now extended to March 31, 2009), and wanted an authorized working group of performers invested in the Interactive field to actively monitor and ensure that progress towards reaching a timely successor Interactive Agreement was not overlooked during the intensive preparations necessary for the Commercials Contracts.
The ISC was appointed from among working AFTRA members who have substantial employment under, and working knowledge of, the AFTRA Interactive Agreement. The ISC consists of working AFTRA performers from the three major centers of AFTRA’s Interactive employment: Los Angeles, San Francisco, and New York. During the month of August, the ISC also met with groups of working members from these and other cities. Every one of these members has substantial work experience under the AFTRA Interactive Agreement, and is also a dual card holder.Members of the ISC and working groups have provided their talents on games such as Grand Theft Auto, Gears of War, Halo II & III, Final Fantasy, Trilogy III, Mercenaries, Metal Gear IV, Speed Racer, Godfather II, Batman, Unreal Tournament, Halo Wars, Spiderman III, Lord of the Rings, CSI 3, Kane and Lynch, Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic and Star Wars Force Unleashed, to name just a few. We are deeply appreciative to these working AFTRA performers who are volunteering their time to participate in and guide our process, and for sharing their extensive experience and understanding of this field on behalf of their fellow performers.
The ISC has determined that it is in the best interests of working members to attempt to resolve a successor agreement sooner rather than later, and it would not be in the best interests of working performers to delay our work and possibly compromise timely implementation of any wage increases and improved conditions that are ultimately negotiated. To that end, it is in the best interests of performers to hold off-the-record conversations with representatives of the AFTRA signatory employers in early September to determine if a framework for reaching a successor agreement in a timely fashion is possible. Once we have had an opportunity to determine whether reaching an acceptable framework is possible (or not), meetings will be held for AFTRA members working under the AFTRA Interactive Agreement for their information and input. Those meetings have not yet been scheduled, but we anticipate they will be held in late September.
The ISC members have also determined that, having successfully achieved more than 30% increases in base rates in our 2005 negotiations, establishing a structure for residual or “back-end” payments is one of the priorities that must be addressed in reaching a successor agreement in this 2008 cycle.
We are all committed to executing a sober, thoughtful and strategic approach to reaching a strong successor agreement for working performers. As such, AFTRA will not engage in any discussions in the press, on blogs, or viral e-mails nor allow the AFTRA Interactive Agreement, or any other contract, to be used for political purposes. Official notices of informational meetings where AFTRA members can receive accurate complete information and provide their input will be sent to interested members later this month.
Editor-in-Chief Nikki Finke - tip her here.


imagine if we all just focused on facts instead of rhetoric and personal attack:
fact:
aftra has a long history of hostile and predatory behavior towards sag: poaching shows, blurring jurisdictional lines, and then offering substandard contracts to actors by undercutting sag.
fact:
aftra, despite protestations they were “pushed out the door” by sag, broke an agreement to negotiate the current tv/theatrical contract with sag, as they had done for the previous 28 years, after making an commitment to do so with afl-cio president john sweeney and sag president alan rosenberg.
fact:
aftra then made tv/theatrical deal with the amptp that allows non-union work, in violation of sag’s core principles. the deal put in place the same terms for aftra the dga and wga agreed to, which impact actors much harder since actors rely for up to and even beyond 50% of their income from residuals, and the aftra “template deal” contains, for all intents and purposes, no residuals for new media original content or reuse.
fact:
now, aftra, without any consultation with sag, has initiated w&w talks with interactive voice-over actors, in what has become a multi-billion dollar industry, after previously pushing a deal sag had to accept that contained no residuals for such work.
that the current slate of sag actors, known as unite for strength, has as it’s central platform issue, merger with aftra, should be of deep concern to all sag actors.
this latest action by aftra clearly demonstrates that aftra continues to compete with sag by driving down actors wages, pension and health, workplace conditions, residuals – and continues to threaten the actor with a substantially reduced livelihood by offering producers a cheaper option, with vastly reduced residuals or no residuals at all.
can actors afford the actions of the newly emboldened aftra? or, is it time for sag to stand up to the blatently hostile behavior of it supposed “sister union,” and begin the process, through the current elections and beyond, of convincing the 44,000 dual card holders of both unions, that the time has come to faze out aftra poaching and substandard contracts in violation of sag’s core principals, by having actors refuse to work aftra contracts, until sag can fully protect all actors under its strong protections, wages, residuals and benefits.
actors themselves will decide. however, this latest action by aftra, is one more indication of aftra’s hostile intent towards the proud record of sag, and its 75 years of service of hard fought and won concessions fom producers, that allow actors the chance to make a decent living, and to be treated with respect by their employers, under the watchful eye of their union – the screen actors guild.
i don’t care if alan rosenberg is the biggest a-hole who ever roamed the earth, it’s no excuse for AFTRA to forsake its membership by accepting a horrible, destructive contract. clearly, they’re willing to do it again to their voice over membership.
negotiations are about the members, not about whether one union leader likes another union leader. if roberta reardon is going to stomp off the playground because she doesn’t like the other kids in the yard, then she should take her ball and go home because she’s not qualified to be a union leader.
If I didn’t know any better (which I don’t) I’d say AFTRA is out to destroy SAG and that the AMTP must be pulling the strings either financially or non-financially with the key personnel.
AFTRA’s actions are in no way in the best interest of their members, and the only people gaining are themselves as AMTP migrates productions over to the weaker AFTRA contracts and they can pay themselves bigger fat cat salaries as they get more productions under their umbrella.
Ultimately the AMTP doesn’t care whether they succeed in destroying SAG or not, they win even if the attempt fails, but AFTRA are too stupid to see themselves being taken for a ride.
Let’s see…
Interactive was originally an AFTRA contract that SAG poached.
Interactive has never been a Phase One contract.
Please put your game on pause.
Galahad is correct. This is more hysterical nonsense from MeFirst and its clown princes.
Interactive has never been Phase 1, and has always been AFTRA. Just because SAG got into the room last time around (and almost blew up the deal!) doesn’t mean AFTRA will be stupid enough to let morons like Bell back in again.
AFTRA got 32% three years ago.
What has MeFirst brought in? Nothing. Not on Interactive. Not on Theatrical. Not on commercials.
Get your ballots in folks and let’s ditch these turkeys!
“interactive has never been phase 1″
well – it shouldn’t be – it should be negotiated by sag, not aftra. to “the obvious” – what a GREAT job aftra did last time around, GIVING residuals away in the last voice-over interactive contract, which is now a multi-billion dollar industry.
you aftra-huggers and u4s people keep making excuses for the guy who is STEALING from sag’s house and it’s members. how long do you think this line of reasoning will hold up?! “aftra, which is selling you cheap, and with no residuals, is the union for YOU mr. or mrs. actor – NOT sag, with the higher (much higher) wages, workplace protections, residuals and pension and health.”
it’s time for aftra to get a taste of its own medicine. sag absolutely should declare war on these poachers. let’s get them OUT of the acting business, so actors have a shot at a decent living, and roberta reardon and kim hedgepath, have a shot at retirement from representing actors – due to complete incompetence and negligence.
I think every post here makes your choice crystal clear:
Vote MF – continue with the war on AFTRA and try to FORCE AFTRA to give up the Actors to SAG, which are 75% of it’s membership.
Vote U4S – Stop the war with AFTRA and get all Actors UNITED against the AMPTP.
“United we stand. Divided we fall.” That has never been more true. If you are on the fence, just look to that one extreme difference.
‘The Obvious’ said…
“Just because SAG got into the room last time around (and almost blew up the deal!) doesn’t mean AFTRA will be stupid enough to let morons like Bell back in again.”
I was in that room. You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. Michael Bell FOUGHT for performers to try to get them a fair share of the profits from the highest grossing video games they work on.
AFTRA has an institutional agenda – gaining jurisdiction – not to benefit performers, but to prop up failing non-actor pension plans. They don’t care at all how much their performers make as long as they can generate more P&H money for the union the actors will never be able to qualify to collect (because of low bargain basement rates and having to split income between AFTRA and SAG). Of course they’re keeping him out. He puts MEMBERSHIP FIRST and fights for their interests – not the interests of the institutions.
It was the Restore Respect President, the SAG NED (who had been hired from AFTRA by Restore Respect) and AFTRA itself that blew up our deal.
The producers were days from giving us residuals (several of them later confirmed that fact in private) but AFTRA senior staff lied to its Negotiating Committee and convinced them that caving was the only option, even though the SAG Negotiating team was ready to stand firm with them to get residuals. On top of that our Restore Respect President and NED refused to support the SAG Negotiating Committee’s continued efforts to get residuals, and was ready to blame everything on them even though 62% voted in favor of a strike. If everyone had maintained their solidarity, we’d have residuals on video games NOW.
UFS is basing their campaign on pipe dreams. Have any of you seen any specific plan to merge the two unions from them? You haven’t, because they don’t have one. Do you know that the trustees of the SAG Pension plan have no intention of allowing the two plans to merge because it would be financially irresponsible to do so… even if the unions themselves merged? We need SAG representing all performers of scripted entertainment – PERIOD. Let AFTRA keep jurisdiction over everything else.
And, UFS, learn a few things about how negotiating works. The one who blinks last wins. MF is doing exactly what has to be done, since AMPTP isn’t in any hurry to deal seriously until the results of the election are known. Why cave like AFTRA always does? Don’t our members deserve better?
So, just how do you get a residual in interactive?
Do you run to the home of each seven year old and demand a dime each time the kid plays the game?
MeFirst morons… don’t know the difference between a royalty and a residual, but they sure have their core principals.
Condor/Wakely/Fred has to explain how an AFTRA only contract is “stealing from SAG’s house.” This should be so Joliffe-esque. It will work right after he explains how an AFTRA $108,000 pension is really less than a SAG $96,000 (starting in a couple of months) pension.
“MeFirst Hertz” –
FYI – most players are adults who sometimes pay millions of dollars a month in total for subscriptions for MMOG online games. Who cares what you call it. Call if a bump, call it a residual, but if a game is making $500 million dollars in one week (Halo 3) it should freakin’ pay some back end to the talent.
OK -
Let’s do this so someone like MeFirst Hertz can understand.
The accrual rate at SAG is 3.5% for every dollar earned up to $225,000 per EMPLOYER per year.
The accrual rate at AFTRA is 1.7% for the first $50,000 then lowered to 1.5% for the next $150,000 – Up to the maximum of $200,000 per MEMBER per year.
So… An actor has a great year and earns $200K from Sony – $200K from Disney – $200K from Warner Bros. For a grand total of $600,000 for that one year. Under SAG that actor would get a $600,000 credit accrued at 3.5%. Under AFTRA that actor would get a $200,000 credit accrued at 1.7% for the first $50,000 then 1.5% for the next $150,000.
Even someone like MeFirst Hertz can see that the SAG actor will accrue a better pension much faster in SAG than in AFTRA.
Only two groups EVER get the maximum pension at AFTRA. Broadcasters and Soap Opera stars who have steady 6-figure earnings for 35/40 years.
The other thing Mr./Ms. MeFirst Hertz should realize is the ridiculous/outrageous penalty AFTRA imposes for early retirement. It’s 6% per year, opposed to SAG at 3% per year.
So… a maximum $9,000 per month AFTRA pension taken at 55 would be reduced to – $3,600.
The maximum $8,000 per month SAG pension taken at 55 would be reduced to – $5,600.
So go tell the stunt performer who can’t do roll-overs or 150-ft falls at 55 years old and now needs his/her pension, that it was better to be in the AFTRA Plan at 55 than the SAG Plan.
THAT’S how Mr Jolliffe (two “ll’s” by the way) “explains how an AFTRA $108,000 pension is really less than a SAG $96,000 pension.
The SAG pension is FAR superior given the ups and downs of an ACTORS career and earning patterns.
And, the SAG Plan is unconditionally better when applied to early retirement.
You wanna now get into how screwed actors are when it comes to the AFTRA Health Plan.
Fish – meet – barrel!
I got a solution. check this out: we pick a neutral site, some huge open field in the middle of the country somewhere.
mf vs. u4s and aftra-huggers.
fight to the death. filmed for the internet.
then, just before we start? sag sends an emissary over to the u4s and aftra-hugger lines and delivers one demand.
1. give up.
u4s huddles with the aftra-huggers for a couple minutes. they send an emissary back:
1. we give up
2. no residuals
Been There, how do you get all actors united against the AMPTP when AFTRA has already given up the fight against them and signed their bloody contract? Or are you suggesting that SAG give up the war with AFTRA by signing the contract too? Is that what voting for U4S is really all about?
Joliffe/Condor-
How many people does that cap affect? 10? 20? In exchange for giving fat fast pensions to loopers like you, you want to take away pensions from everybody under $20k per year – that’s more than 85% of SAG, zeroed out for your extra money.
Talk about MeFirst!!!
how did we get into a situation where MEfirst and UFS are the only two choices?…apathetic membership, that’s how. most SAG and AFTRA members don’t bother voting, even..then get pissed when this kind of bullshit happens. I suggest we members make it our business TO get involved, from now on, however we’re able…because it sounds like we lose with either slate, TBQFH(to be quite fucking honest). Is there no one within SAG or AFTRA membership with the relevant experience to set this nonsense straight? Or are we doomed to the same old assholes again and again? This shit will happen all over again in 3 years, if we keep dealing with the same old, same old, or, we elect newbies without a clue…no offense, UFS, but you guys are looking like a collective Sarah Palin to me right about now. I’m a dual card holder, and I’m disgusted by SAG’s arrogance, and AFTRA’s jackie collins-style treachery. How about you all get a fuckin’ clue so no one else loses their house, hmmm?
Been There Should’ve Stayed There,
The only think I’m saying is that a civil war with AFTRA puts EVERY contract in jeapordy.
Why does everyone think that just because SAG and AFTRA work together that it means capitulation by SAG? It never has in the past.
As long as MF wages a civil war against AFTRA we will be fighting each other and NOT the AMPTP. It effectively takes our strike card off the table for as long as the war continues UNLESS both SAG and AFTRA agree to negotiate together.
Do you really think that AFTRA will let MF try to rip 75% of it’s members out of it’s union without a fight? I don’t.
The only way to fight the AMPTP is to work TOGETHER. And the MF is not willing to do that. U4S is.
Vote accordingly.
“been somewhere but not there”:
what about “aftra broke ranks to take this shitty tv/theatrical deal” don’t you understand?
what about”aftra is having w&w talks and planning to negotiate without sag (yes, it’s not phase 1, but still – it’s the INVERSE of your point) on vo actor interactive multi-billion dollar industry contract – after taking the last deal while leaving residuals on the table” don’t you understand?
what about aftra and it’s history of predatory and hostile behavior towards sag don’t you understand?
what about AFTRA, not sag, breaking cvr-17 that says neither union will undercut the other don’t you understand?
why do people even TRY to make the argument, that, on balance, sag has been the aggressor in this feud?
has sag put pressure on aftra? hell yes? why? to try to STOP aftra from selling actors cheap and CREATING this rift the producers then exploit!
but everybody’s all “poor aftra”
let’s merge with this union that wants us dead. WTF!
you know what? FUCK AFTRA. how many times do you expect sag to be stabbed in the back by this union which is – helloooo? – clearly looking to compete – NOT cooperate – before sag responds?
the time is NOW. should sag take steps to neutralize aftra as an actors union because of aftra’s repeated, longstanding history of undercutting sag. YES!
sag, IF they get a mandate for mf in this election, needs to get a strike authorization, put the amptp’s balls right in the fire, strike if necessary, THEN turn on aftra, and make it clear there will be no more bullshit, while slowly weaning actors off aftra’s cheap ass antics and bringing those actors under the protections of the screen actors guild.
enough is enough.
MeFirst Hertz:
The cap affects many long-time members of SAG. And pays them more fairly for what they’ve put in.
But, as you see, there is no answer to the meat of the AFTRA matter.
No answer regarding the obscene 6% per year penalty for early retirement.
No answer for the extremely low accrual rate.
No answer for the $200K per MEMBER annual limit on the H&R accrual.
And again… You wanna start talking about the AFTRA health plan?
Let’s start with this:
$603.00 per quarter premium for a family of 4 in AFTRA. When at SAG it’s $150.00.
Full dependant coverage at SAG at $10,000 earnings per year – Versus AFTRA at $30,000.
AFTRA buy-up rates for one dependant is $1,1879 per quarter. More than one dependant is $2,265.
There is no premium in SAG for participants with 20 years versus AFTRA which has a premium for any retiree coverage.
Shall I go on?
Hey all- I work in the games biz on the development side. I direct and produce games and I can assure you- from a residuals standpoint- the negotiations are irrelevant. If residuals are what your members want, you may as well not even show up to the bargaining table.
The reason for this is twofold:
1- the people who make the games- design, program, art, develop- do not get residuals. They are lucky to get a bonus when the game makes profit. In many ways, it is like the old Hollywood studio system. To ask those workers to be ok and accept the fact that one element- and a small element at that- of the package is going to be playing by the new Hollywood system (i.e. residuals) while they are stuck in the dark ages will create chaos with the game biz.
2- Voice Over acting quality makes no difference to game sales. It’s nice to have. But the reality is, review scores and game sales do not rise or fall based on voice over talent. Heck, scores and sales are not impacted when we use some of the biggest stars from linear media.No one cares if Vin Disel or Bruce Willis or Tom Cruise ‘stars’ in a game via motion capture, face capture, and voice over services. It makes no difference. Been playing Soul Calibur 4 this weekend and using the Darth Vader character and he sounds enough like James Earl Jones that I’m happy enough. Could care less if it’s the real deal. Game players simply don’t care. As a director, I care because I want my products to be as pro as possible. But end of the day, I’ll take a non union actor (or more to the point, a union guy who will do the work off the record) well before I’ll open this can of worms.
I value actors- love them and admire them. They amaze me at times with how good they can be at their craft. But from a pure business standpoint, this is a fight they really don’t want to have because the game biz- if pushed on this issue- will simply get up and walk away from the table without a second thought.
Per the AFTRA e-mail that just came out, it does indeed look like AFTRA plans to go it alone. My understanding is that 2005 is the first time SAG participated in Interactive negotiations. So it’s not like there’s a longstanding tradition or anything.
Maybe if SAG stopped being so hostile to AFTRA and acted like they wanted to approach things collegially, a joint bargaining arrangement could be fashioned. But at present it seems like AFTRA gets nothing but grief from SAG. Why, therefore, should AFTRA feel obliged to do something different than it’s doing?
LA VO
Kwest claims they don’t need us. I’ve been involved in three separate games in the last two years that had to be completely re-voiced because of the crappy non-union talent they used to try to save money before the publisher screamed ‘fix this’ with real (union) talent.
Most people voicing leads in these games wouldn’t work off the card these days on a big game, and there’s no way the producers would hire name actors if it didn’t impact sales. Casting Directors DREAD having to cast a game non-union… the talent ends up costing the producers more because not only are they sub-par acting wise, but it takes them four times as long to get through the script (and three times longer to cast it).
They said the same “we don’t really need you” thing in 2005… but they still stuck around and signed a deal. The producers always say they don’t need us as a negotiating tactic, but in reality, with the stories in the games getting more involved, and the audience expecting more and more quality, they do need professional union talent.
If paying residuals on the top games is going to force them to have to pay their other workers properly, that’s just the cost of doing business. You can’t have sales of $500 million in one week (Halo 3) and expect the people who create the games to not start demanding a bigger piece of the pie. The programmers are starting to organize, too. These are Hollywood entertainment products now and the industry is going to have to grow up if it wants to the product to look, sound and feel like a interactive theatrical motion picture like the customers are demanding.
2005 All Over Again,
Again, I hope you saw the part where I mentioned I value good acting in my games as well as in general. And I too have recast on several occasions when the VO was not up to par. So I am NOT saying quality VO does not add to the game. It sure as hell does. No argument.
I am just saying it does not add to the sales. And the reason it seems like 2005 all over again with the ‘we don’t really need you’ thing is because, in essence, it is true. It is not negotiation tactic. Truth be told, our industry is not mature enough to- in my mind- utilize negotiation tactics.
And I’ve had people at my company- one of the biggest- speak with me about the very issue and my recommendation is always: pay them fair, pay them with the massive respect they deserve, make sure they are getting an improved deal each time we resign (just like we should be getting new stuff in the new deal that we wanted last time) but DO NOT give up residuals.
We’ll see after this round if that changes but I spoke with a VO casting director 2 weeks ago about getting voices for my new game and we were both pretty clear on the issue of either get a union person who will lie or just go non union.
Some games it makes more of a difference- big epic story games and in those cases you may see actors negotiate on a title by title basis- but 95% of the games it make no difference and I assume you will not see any movement on the residual front this time around.
But we can agree to disagree. Again, not trying to fight with you. We’ve all got lives to support and I totally appreciate it from your side.
Anonymous/Condor/Joliffe,
What about the SAG break in service rules that AFTRA doesn’t have? Another way to rip off pensions from working actors to feed the loopers?
What about the $20,000 per year qualifying level for a pension credit when it’s $7500 in AFTRA? Another way to rip off pensions from working actors to feed the loopers?
Kwest’s only half right. WHO does the VO doesn’t matter. All it needs to be is professional. That usually means union, but not always.
All you AFTRA bashers and MeFirst huggers don’t get it. Dopes like Bell who brag about raiding plans and tools like the Allens who help that kind of crap along mean as long as the crazies are in control, SAG will be on its own.
Kwest…
You seem fair and respectful of the talent, and to be fair on my end, you’re right… the games that don’t have heavy story lines and aren’t aiming for a huge market can do fine with throwaway voices… but those aren’t the ones the actors will target for residuals.
Last time they only wanted back end from the biggies. Not everything… just the insane money makers. The only reason they didn’t get it was because there were two unions vying for jurisdiction and AFTRA was willing to cave. This time the performers aren’t going to let either union drop the ball. A performer who destroys his or her voice for weeks screaming their way through a $300 million dollar grossing game needs more than lozenges to soothe the pain. If they want to do it for scale and no residuals on a PC only title that will gross $150K, that’s their choice. There’s no money there for resids, and everyone knows that. No one is asking for anything that’s going to hurt anyone’s budget.
The creative staff at the big game companies have been promised profit sharing before… and in two cases they were all fired or quit when the companies refused to pay out after making hundreds of millions in profit. Lots of times they hire young kids right out of school they can lie to… 16 hour days, sleeping under their desks, for the promise of a huge bump when the profits roll in… then they eliminate the division (or developer) they work for right after the game hits big so they don’t have to pay. No wonder everyone is starting to organizing.
There’s WAY too much money on the table now to not share it, and the main reason they’re not paying out is greed. If you create something that makes huge money, you get a small piece of the pie… that’s the way it’s been in Hollywood for decades. There’s no business reason for the actors to continue to take less on products that gross more than feature films!
The film industry doesn’t pay the crew residuals, but they still manage to function financially paying residuals to the talent (actors, writers, directors). If AFTRA and SAG both go for it this time (and AFTRA indicated it would in its letter today), the industry will get used to doing things differently. Change is hard, but it’ll happen.
And you say the industry is not sophisticated enough to use negotiating tactics? But y’all hired a professional negotiator last round and BOY did he negotiate! The industry is mature. Time for us all to act like adults here and deal on a higher level. No one will suffer. There’s plenty of money in the pot.
Bell was for the contract before he was against it. Now it’s “AFTRA caved.” Back then it was unanimous.