This was sent to members by SAG's National Executive Director & Chief Negotiator and uploaded to the guild's website today:
Dear Member,
On October 19, your National Board voted by 97% - 3% to send out a strike authorization ballot to members if mediation in the TV/Theatrical contract failed. We made a determined effort to mediate the contract negotiations but could not reach agreement in the face of the AMPTP's refusal to compromise. After mediation failed, a number of national board members publicly repudiated the board's almost unanimous decision to ask the members to authorize the board to decide whether, and if so when, to call a strike. Although I believe giving the National Board the authorization to determine whether to call a strike is our best strategy, that strategy has been severely compromised by the division of a now deeply and publicly split National Board leadership. President Rosenberg and I called a special meeting of the National Board to attempt to resolve those differences. That board meeting ended with no action after two days and twenty four hours of continuous executive session. During the hours of that executive session, I proposed a compromise to move Screen Actors Guild forward. Because my subsequent letter to the board describing my proposal has been made public, I wanted you to hear from me what I proposed. If the National Board does not adopt this compromise, or otherwise change the decision the board made in October, the strike authorization referendum will be conducted, with ballots sent to every eligible member for a vote.
Please read my letter to the National Board. I encourage you to communicate with your elected leadership and me your views on this subject.
In unity,
Doug Allen National Executive Director & Chief Negotiator
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Doug Allen's Letter to the National Board of Directors January 14, 2009Dear SAG National Board Members and Alternates,
Because the executive session of our recent extraordinary National Board meeting occurred without my presence in the room, I want to directly communicate several points to all board members and alternates.
I began and ended my report to the National Board on January 12 by stating that I have followed and always will follow the directives of the National Board expressed by a unanimous or majority vote. Under my leadership all SAG staff has complied and will comply with those directives as well. I also said that I am by SAG constitution and by employment contract accountable to the board for my performance.
I welcome your review of that performance and respectfully request only that, in the interest of fairness, such review include the opportunity for me to discuss with the board any comments, questions or issues you wish to raise, not in lieu of executive session discussion, but prior to such discussion.
It is unfortunate that the important matters contained in the National Board meeting agenda were not accomplished at the meeting January 12 and 13. I know that opinions vary sharply on why that happened. From my perspective, to the extent AMPTP positions or actions are the problem, the solution cannot be determined by how intensely you fight among yourselves.
Regarding the TV/Theatrical negotiations, and the sharply divided opinions on the board about how to proceed, I offered the following suggestion to a cross section of Guild leaders during the period of the executive session. I asked that they discuss the suggestion with other board members in attendance. I proposed that the strike authorization referendum be suspended and that management's offer be put to the membership in a ratification vote. I also proposed that, before that membership ratification vote, we meet immediately with the AMPTP to determine to what extent, if any, they are willing to improve their last offer, to maximize its chances for ratification. I further proposed that the offer then be sent to the members with Pro and Con statements from National Board members and that otherwise the Guild would remain neutral during any member debate regarding ratification. This process will give Screen Actors Guild members the opportunity to formally express themselves on the bargaining issues.
This suggestion was communicated to some, but not all board members in attendance, and apparently was rejected by some who heard it, at least in part, because they believe I could not be "trusted" to implement it. Since I am the one proposing it and since I have never acted contrary to the directives of the National Board, that is not a reasonable objection. In any case, if it is the decision of the National Board to proceed as I have proposed, I assure you that the staff and I will carry out your decision faithfully and diligently.
I will convene an Officers' call this week to discuss this suggestion and how it might be considered and implemented. I encourage all board members to discuss these issues with the Guild officers or with me in advance of the call.
There are no more important issues before us than the conclusion of the TV/Theatrical Contract negotiations and the initiation of the Commercial Contract negotiations. Super-heated rhetoric through the press will not contribute to our success on behalf of the members. Working together to resolve your differences will.
Doug Allen
Carl Icahn Now Wants ALL Of Lionsgate
In this economy, it is incumbent on the union leadership to consider all avenues open. In reading the vast array of comments from various guild members, it is clear to me that the most viable and safe option for all concerned would be to sign a contract with the same terms accepted by the WGA, DGA and AFTRA. In 3 years, when these guilds negotiate a new contract, then all the unions can get together, strengthen their positions by deciding which issues should be non-negotiable and which issues have room for discussion.
AFTRA and SAG both represent actors, although the representation is more clearly defined. That being said, the fact that AFTRA, DGA and WGA put their memberships first in signing the contracts tells me their leadership put the practical dollars and cents issues first.
In a strike, NO ONE WINS. The WGA strike paralyzed the industry and nearly permanently damaged the availability of quality scripted television. People in the industry – non-writers – lost their homes, their benefits and their ability to take care of their families.
Think and plan instead of posturing and thumping your chests.
After the cancellation of the GCCs for the independents, I don’t believe Doug Allen either.
Paris, you are obviously not an actor. Don’t comment on the “terms” unless you know what they mean to you as an actor. The terms are currently unacceptable and are already different than the other unions. At its most simplistic, directors and writers don’t step in front of the camera, actors do. This is entirely different.
paris,
if the DGA, WGA and AFTRA’s acceptance of the deal results in creating
a huge non-union workspace that eliminates residuals, then they did
not put their memberships first, but rather sold them out in the
long-run for some short-term comfort.
i want everyone to prosper, but now some folks like you in the other guilds and in the businesses that depend on the industry,
are saying, “Take the shitty deal so we don’t have to worry.’
you are telling us to throw away our future so you can have yours.
i don’t want anyone to lose their home. i don’t want anyone to be without health insurance. perhaps, by the time President Obama
leaves office we’ll have a National health plan.
everyone is worried about paying the bills.
but as goes SAG, so goes the rest of the industry’s workforce.
if they weaken us, one by one they’ll pick off the rest of you.
SAG doesn’t deserve less.
we all deserve more.
You know, if all you liberals ruled the world during the formation of this great country, that is America, we would still be under the Queens rule…..It is a same that no one wants to get their hands dirty anymore, and everyone wants everything handed to them. You get what your worth, so maybe “Paris” you are worth- not receiving residuals and having your job eliminated by cheaper, non-union labor. I guess something is better than nothing, and I am sure your sitting home waiting for your welfare, Opps, I mean stimulus check, to arrive in the mail too.
Please, stop the madness… I am going bankrupt. Doug, AMPTP, PLEASE… just stop. Let’s all get back to work, and dig ourselves out of this hole for the next couple years!!! Every freaking month that goes by will take blood sweat and limitless elbow grease to make up for. I’m on the edge of bankruptcy, and will soon just have to move to another part of the country/world, and edit corporate videos, or some other nonsense for the rest of my life.
Go ahead, destroy the industry at a historic time of weakness.
Well ‘Paris’, your first paragraph is not only old news, but that AMPTP spin statement has been debunked many times over. Actors are paid residuals differently than DGA and WGA members. Plus, AFTRA “negotiators” didn’t negotiate at all – they simply cowered and took a shit deal to keep AFTRA alive – at the expense of their membership and SAG, both of which I’m a member.
And it sounds like you’re blaming the WGA for being forced to strike by a greedy AMPTP. Since you’re obviously not a SAG member (or any guild member?), maybe you should read a little more before posting your opinions publicly.
“In a strike, NO ONE WINS.” Brilliant! Great perception! Strikes are about who loses less, not who wins. One side may/will prevail, but it will be at a cost no matter how you slice it. And make no mistake, that cost rests solely on the shoulders of the greedy AMPTP, not SAG. All of this BS about “strategy” has little to do with management offering a fair contract. And whether or not anyone believes that SAG has had a good strategy, the AMPTP blames the stalemate on said strategy, not because of their greedy, shitty proposal. Which is to blur the truth of said greedy, shitty proposal. It’s called spin.
Sounds to me like everyone talking about bad strategy thinks SAG doesn’t deserve a fair contract because of perceived “bad strategy”. Yeah, any excuse to blame SAG for the current state of affairs…
More to the point of this topic, Doug Allen has been backed into a corner (again) by the weak U4S and NY board members – members who (as he states correctly) voted almost unanimously to have him do what he’s been doing, and then changed “plans” in the middle of the stream and stabbed him and Alan Rosenberg in their respective back(s). DA is saying honestly that he’s been making recommendations, but doing SAG’s bidding (as voted upon by the board). It’s a shame that he has to remind everyone (the membership, the board…) that this is the case. It’s a shame that the SAG membership isn’t behind him 100% now, after voting so strongly that we’d be there to back him up.
An interesting note about the last paragraph of his memo: he states, “Super-heated rhetoric through the press will not contribute to our success on behalf of the members. Working together to resolve your differences will.” A truer statement has not been written.
But notice he said “your differences”, not “our differences”.
Think he’s feeling a little played by now?
Fight the battle now, lick our wounds and fight. If we do not draw the line in the sand now, the line will be erased forever. It’s that simple and that scary, but we must secure our future earning NOW, not in 3 years.
Jesus Christ, just fucking DO something!!! You get the vote for a strike authorization ballot, but you don’t send it out. You suggest sending the contract out instead, but you don’t send it out. Now you don’t know if you want to send out the strike ballot or the contract or … what? JUST FUCKING DO SOMETHING!!! ANYTHING!!!
This has gone on for a year now. You clowns are KILLING the rest of us with your indecision. Accept the contract so we can get to work. Or go on strike so it will fail and can get to work. But do SOMETHING so we can get to work!!!
Ok, I fully admit I’m not a SAG, DGA, WGA, or any other guild member, just an average citizen trying to understand the issues…that being said, I just have a question.
If this proposal is agreed upon and the contract sent out for ratification, what happens if the membership votes it down? Does it force the AMPTP to come up with a new offer or a lock out of the actors or something else?
Can’t we stop arguing long enough to discuss THIS? I’ve posted several time and no one has ever disputed the fact that it’s a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG shot that a strike authorization will ever pass the membership at 75%. Were I bookie it would be greater odds that the Cubs would win the Superbowl (and yes, I know they are a baseball team!).
The membership has lost faith in it’s leadership. The newly elected U4S is under constant barrage by MF. The MF is under constant barrage by U4S. Neither has enough strength to get anything accomplished. The margins are just too thin. All we get is procedural issues that ensure NOTHING GETS DONE. This is a reflection of the membership as well. We are clearly divided.
SAG has wasted tons of money on Strike Authorization rhetoric. Let’s stop wasting money and just vote on the contract.
If it’s voted up, so be it.
If it’s voted down, THAT IS NOT A DICTATE TO CONTINUE WITH THE SAME OLD CRAP! Both Doug Allen and Alan Rosenberg need to understand that and make it CLEAR when they send out the voting materials. If the contract is voted down, then let’s put a NEUTRAL or bi-partisan negotiating committee together that BOTH factions will trust. ONLY THEN will there be any hope of furthering negotiations.
As long as either MF is completely in charge of the negotiations, there will NEVER be a Strike Authorization (see above odds) and we will continue in limbo.
Let the egos end and let’s get a bi-partisan committee together and REALLY get something done. MF needs to read the writing on the wall and U4S needs to work WITH THEM to accomplish anything. Anything less is the death knell for our union!
Okay, as a person with an HR background, SAG’s executive board meeting seemed to turn into a review and attempt to fire Doug Allen, without Doug Allen present. This goes against current HR policies about review and termination.
During a review, even if the board’s mind is made up, the employee gets to hear the review and respond to the review, in person! This is so unprofessional. Who have you guys got running SAG?
This is a blatant attempt to derail the strike by overturning the negotiator, since those who wanted Mr. Allen fired are in the minority and holding the rest of the board hostage.
It’s akin to Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid playing nice with the Republicans in the spirit of bipartisanship, while the Republicans know full well they’re only power as a minority is to stall, accuse, obfuscate, and use every tactic in the book to delay and hopefully abort any legislation they don’t like. The Republicans are not about bipartisanship and Harry Reid is a spineless wonder. End game: stalemate.
So here you have SAG, with a minority trying to stall, stall, stall. And if they can abort the whole process, they would probably gladly work without a contract until 2012. And then, they argue, we’ll all negotiate with the other guilds from a position of power.
Yeah, right. If you didn’t get together with the other guilds before, what makes you think you’ll do so then?
SAG has an unprofessional board and weak majority leadership. You need to send out the contract for a vote or the strike authorization for a vote.
Get some spine and trust your membership. Let them vote.
But the BIG problem is the minority DOES NOT trust the membership to vote. So they don’t want ANY vote.
SAG membership, do you like being insulted in this way? Treated like you cannot be trusted to make your own decisions?
SAG board, this needs to stop now. It’s unhealthy. It’s heavily narcissistic. And the lot of you board members, based upon your behavior, probably should be in therapy.
And if money’s an issue, I can recommend a number of free clinics.
Here come the “regulars” (where’s Matt Mulhern???) waiting to pounce on anyone who may disagree with their scortched-earth campaign to destroy Hollywood for everyone.
Paris (not Hilton) made the same point that SO MANY others have made already, but these “regulars” just won’t have it.
Why is it so difficult for these people in Membership First to listen to anyone except for those who already agree with them?
Personally, I just can’t wait until this is all over.
And who in hell tied his hands? What an ignorant asshole and what bullshit this man continues to pile upon this sham of a botched negotiation. How does SAG tolerate such a poor performance from a highly paid ‘negotiator?’ Give him his silly ass vote and jettison the son-of-a-bitch before he completely guts our union.
Helenofpeel:
It’s called “executive session” where union execs are asked to leave the room when officers of the union discuss their pay grade, salary increase proposals, or their status on the job. Mr. Allen has been getting “performance reviews” in his in-box on an hourly basis since the beginning of his tenure from thousands of SAG members.
Harry98, before you choke up more bile go on aftra.com and read their deal in its entirety. Actors get plenty of residuals under the AFTRA deal in new media plus concrete threshholds where management must go union. Don’t read the Classic Comic version; do your homework, then vent after you’ve done some reading.
It is a pity that the AMTPT botched this negotiation so badly.I think it is high time they made changes in their negotiating team.
I’m a TV costumer who got into SAG by being on set on a couple of occasions when producers needed a warm body to say some quick-and-dirty new dialogue without going through casting.
And it may be ungrateful of me, but I wish SAG would simply mail out the strike authorization vote as originally planned, because I’m voting against it.
Even though what SAG is asking for is reasonable, I simply cannot afford to be out of work at this time.
(How about waiting to strike until production wraps in a couple of months?)
It’s really clear that the only person keeping SAG alive these days is Doug Allen. I’m guessing that “Actors” understand that, and most of the rest of the people discussing this don’t believe in Unions. If you were such good “Actors” that you don’t need a Union to guarantee bottom-line and below-the-line wages, why do you belong to a Union?
Don’t you understand that huge corporations have bought your movie making companies and they don’t like Unions? They will do whatever it takes to eliminate the Union. It’s not MF or U4S that can’t negotiate with the Corporations, it’s “Actors”. The AMPTP doesn’t want a contract with a Union. They want to be able to negotiate with each Actor on an individual level AND without opening their books to scrutiny (required by a percentage deal.)
The Corporations don’t care who strikes, they just want the Unions to disappear. And, if you think that waiting for two more years is going to help, you are being silly. The Corporations wouldn’t care, in fact, if you gave them two years to prepare, your jobs will never come back. In two years it is possible that “Actor” will only apply to “Theater Productions”. Film and Television will be performed by Dancers in Motion Capture suits with Digital Representations of your face pasted on the images.
You might not believe that, but it might give you pause to learn that I recently received an advertisement for a new motherboard which had 256 64bit CPUs, and sold for under 10 thousand dollars. Pixar started with less.
Now is the time, and your back is against the wall, and there is a very deep hole in front of you. Be real careful of which bridges you burn. Remember, If Actors were such great negotiators, there would never be a negative Paparazzi image.
So let me get this straight. U4S and their allies have suddenly changed their minds about the strike authorization, which was already approved WITH ALMOST ALL OF THEIR VOTES. And they don’t want the membership to have the opportunity to take a straight up/down vote on the AMPTP’s “last best final” union-busting offer.
Instead, they want to fire Doug Allen and replace the negotiating team.
President Rosenberg trusts the members enough to support sending out a strike authorization, even though it requires an insanely high supermajority to pass. After assorted objections, Doug Allen put on the table a reasonable alternate suggestion – send the AMPTP’s offer to the members without an endorsement, and with pro and con statements. Let the members consider the arguments and vote on it – like Californians do with propositions every election. And Mr. Allen suggested giving the AMPTP yet another opportunity to improve on the offer – something neither side in a proposition battle typically has the opportunity to do. But apparently, U4S doesn’t think much of an endorsement-free contract vote either, as some have stated they don’t “trust” Mr. Allen.
So, two questions.
1. Can anyone cite specific instances in which Mr. Allen violated the wishes of the national board in a substantive fashion??? Such examples must be specific and substantive, i.e., the national board ordered Mr. Allen to take a particular action or accomplish a particular task, and he flagrantly ignored them or acted in a manner counter to their clearly-expressed wishes; and they must be substantive violations that would clearly adversely affect the lives and/or professional well-being of actors. If such malfeasance exists, obviously it would need to be addressed. If it doesn’t, then let the man do his job and give him the tools he needs – like a strike authorization, or an up/down vote on the contract.
2. Why is U4S so against members having the opportunity to cast a real vote on this issue – a strike authorization or an up/down on the moguls’ offer??? Is it because they are as aware of the results of the SAG postcard poll as anyone, and they know a strike authorization would pass? Or that the moguls’ offer would be overwhelmingly rejected??? The U4S board members were elected democratically, same as the rest. So why are they now so opposed to be a wee bit of direct democracy???
Given the recent behavior of U4S and their allies, these are quite reasonable questions, and deserve thorough and thoughtful answers from U4S board members.
I’m here “Linda Carter”
Rather than stating the obvious again, I’d love to just cut to the chase here. It’s time. These latest delays have been caused entirely by UFS, not MF. The SAV would be out now, being voted on, where it not for Adam Arkin and Ned Vaughn insisting on a NEW national board meeting to overturn the decision the national board had ALREADY MADE to send out the SAV Jan. 2nd.
The pattern between the “moderates” and the hard-liners” never changes: the AMPTP makes some outrageous proposal well in advance of negotiations, then over time, the outrageous becomes the accepted, and the “moderates” end up screaming to “take the deal!” with the “hard-liners” saying “yeah, but it’s outrageous – remember?”
When the NY Times in 2007, announced Hollywood executives wanted to “end residuals,” I remember the response from ALL the unions was “that’s not serious, and I remember, especially actors I spoke to or read, or bogged with, saying it’s “ridiculous – are you really going to argue about THAT – they’ll never do that – everybody would strike – they can’t pull THAT off.”
Well, here we are. As in the country, the “middle” is SO far to the right, that in SAG the “moderates” are FIGHTING to accept a contract that will gut the middle-class actor and end residuals over time – as if it’s the right thing to do! “Live to fight another day” they say, knowing full well, there won’t be “another day” and even if there were? The “moderates” wouldn’t be willing to fight then either.
The “hard-liners” are people arguing for things NOT TO BE TAKEN AWAY. WOW – now that’s “hard-line” – THAT is TOO aggressive:
DON’T phase out residuals
DON’T take away clip consent
DON’T weaken product placement rules to make actors do ridiculous endorsements in character, or be fired if they refuse
DON’T take away Force Majeure.
DON’T NOT pay us 60 to 100 million bucks you owe us.
DON’T insert a nonunion space in our own contract
Boy that is “hard-line” – that is radical, outrageous, divisive, unrealistic, arrogant, negotiating from those “hard-liners.
Imagine if we were asking FOR something?
Just vote already, and find out if actors are as gutless as UFS makes them seem, or if they have some balls as MF hopes. Jesus Christ already…
This is Awesome. Without a doubt, the most botched negotiation I have ever seen. Where is the leadership?
“There are no more important issues before us than the conclusion of the TV/Theatrical Contract negotiations and the initiation of the Commercial Contract negotiations.”
How can Doug Allen honestly write that statement with a straight face?
What have you truly done to move this forward? All I have seen are delay tactics and bitter infighting over the last several months. How about moving the contract forward?
Keep it up and SAG should be bankrupt in 10 months. Then maybe we can truly have a Working Actors Guild that actually cares about making movies and sustaining our industry. Don’t be afraid of change. Now is the time.
Well I am an ACTOR and I am a MEMBER and I have EDUCATED myself and I don’t believe, at this point that even if we win, we can win well. If we strike we will strike after a weakening and ridiculous ammount of drama. We will strike weakly which is as dangerous as it gets. It means the studios would not believe we could hold out long and that we are not unified in our strike. The only way we could convince them is to strike for a very long time. The gains, if there were any, would not be worth the pain it would inflict on the community.
We won’t have the gun to the studio’s head or even to our own head. We’ll have the gun to everyone else’s head. People who have zero to gain if we do win anything will suffer mightily.
I have yet to read any justification of this by anyone who is pro-strike.
Why is it ok to let others starve for OUR contract? You might say “this is the studios trying to scare us!” Nope. This is people who are looking at the world and the situation with their own independant minds, weighing the possible gains against the certain pains.
I am a SAG member. I make my living as an actor. I am dissatisfied with the contract, with the deal that is on the table. But I don’t think that is enough reason to hurt so many people so badly at such a terrible time. I don’t think we have that right.
I can’t imagine a less constructive step for the guy in charge of this negotiation to take, then to send out this letter covering his ass, airing out inside baseball for everyone to read because he’s concerned with how he’s percieved. As a member of the union he’s ruining, I feel unserved and misrepresented. too bad.
Let’s be clear: UFS/RBD/NY/USAN had the votes to fire Doug Allen and replace the neg com. If they had followed the agreed-upon (BY THEM) agenda, they could EASILY have accomplished that over a relatively drama-free 2 day period.
Day 1 (as AGREED TO BY THEM), let Doug Allen address items on the agenda. do guild business, discuss current contracts etc. Day 2, call “executive session” and, if, after Day 1, they still wanted to fire Doug, take a vote and do so.
INSTEAD, Day 1, after short while, UFS leaps up, asks for “executive session!” introduces motion to fire Doug. Motion is, debated. Yes, pro-SAG leadership members filibuster – if your position was you were fighting off a contract that will gut the middle-class actor and destroy SAG, you would, of course, fight as well.
INSTEAD of following procedure, which would have allowed the members to go home or to their hotels to get a good nights sleep, UFS forces a marathon debate due to the course of action THEY have taken. After 30 HOURS straight, at the VERY END, Gabrielle Carteris sends around a piece of paper gathering signatures. Some of the RBD don’t even know what they are signing (which they are livid about), she then attaches the signatures to the motion to fire Doug.
The documnet is immediately rejected since it requires the signatures of all 71 board members, and THIS includes many “alternates” names, which are inadmissable. Document is rejected.
ENTIRE debacle is due to UFS arrogance and stupidity. If they had displayed calm and smarts – UFS would have its wet dream. Instead they BLEW IT BY THEIR OWN INCOMPETENCE.
UFS voted against Doug’s recommendation to suspend the SAV and send
out the deal for a vote. Why?
The other night, the Hollywood board voted on Doug’s recommendation. It was
a vote of 24 yes, 14 no. All no’s came from UFS. They still think
that if SAG changes the faces on the team, then the AMPTP will
miraculously return to the table to fairly negotiate. If we are still
holding firm on force majeure and jurisdiction in new media, Jesus Christ could
be the lead negotiator and Nick Counter and his team would still tell
SAG to go scratch. The AMPTP will not give up on force majeure and jurisdiction.
Plain and simple. It’s not us, it’s them.
We’d be in the same situation even if John McGuire was the lead negotiator. And he
would hold firm on force majeure and jurisdiction too. Just like Doug and the
majority of the negotiation committee.
Again – people keep talking about 2011 being the “mother of all strikes.”
Well, why do you think the AMPTP is holding firm on getting force majeure out of
our contract? They too FEAR that the WGA could possibly go out. Or the
Teamsters. Or IASTE. Which would shut down the town, making our force majeure
clause kick in. There is no way these unions will strike together.
It’s virtually impossible. One of these unions will go out before we
do in 2011. Can you say “Force Majeure?”
All UFS wants to do is fire Doug and neutralize Membership First and Alan Rosenberg. They want to weaken SAG in order to merge with AFTRA. Gabrielle and Jamie Cromwell
have made it clear. They have stated their plans publicly.
That’s what UFS promised during their campaign. Merger with AFTRA. They never articulated their plan earlier because that would have been political suicide in Hollywood. But now that they are in office, they are trying to put their plan into
action. That is their merger plan. Weaken SAG externally and
internally, then merge.
As I’ve said THIS IS UFS’S plan. They plan to destroy SAG from inside and out.
so when does the first feature come out on digital format? Go AFTRA.
Sorry, R.I.P. S.A.G.
Just make a decision.
Being in limbo is worse for everyone.
Strike or don’t strike, just make the decision.
Stop pounding on the table and do something, anything.
Strike, ok then strike.
Accept contract, ok then lets sign it.
This whole “negotiation” is a farce.
“What is called resignation is confirmed desperation.” — Henry David Thoreau
I’ve never made a good decision when I was desperate. So I can’t imagine any of the desperate comments on this story could glean any good out of the situation. I pray that cooler heads prevail. No matter what you think of the current SAG leaders (on both sides), the general membership is still dependent on them to do the right thing without compromising actors’ livelihoods and protections. That is what we have charged them with. To do less (do I hear AFTRA?) is fraud against the membership. I believe Doug Allen, politics aside, knows this and has stuck to his guns because of it, but now it appears he is afraid to fail — which is why we appear to have action then inaction. Very frustrating for everyone, which is why we’re partially in the situation we’re in.
But here we are. What can we do that is not desperate but moves us along? I believe the board should take a final vote on either a) strike authorization which voting would immediately be sent out or b) ask the AMPTP for their final and best offer and send it out for a membership vote. Those are our two best options that I can see. One or the other must be done immediately. Again, immediately!
The third option, which is what is happening now, is the stalling tactic. But this does not work with our opponent. Our opponent is too powerful and will find a way to reposition itself, considering this stalling tactic is so slow and allows for much time to reposition. Shock and awe might not have worked for Iraq, but it’s the only tactic the AMPTP understands and actually comes to the table on. Shock and awe gets shareholder and media attention and causes the AMPTP to fumble and show it’s real colors.
The continued fiddling while Rome burns is beyond frustrating. Everyone I know is in trouble. For the love of God, take some sort of action. I can’t believe that this is allowed to continue. Argh!
Working Actor:
I hear you, but that is incorrect. There is no “stalling going on” from MF – only from UFS. The national board – controlled by UFS – voted to send out the SAV Jan.2nd and the vote would haver been announced Jan. 23rd – a few days from now.
Why are we still waiting? UFS/NY/RBD/USAN/ and the “stars” – all the “moderates.”
UFS insisted on the Jan 12th national board meeting to “reconsider THEIR OWN VOTE.” And THEN – AT that meeting, with the majority and a simple plan – THEY COULD HAVE FIRED DOUG ALLEN, and replaced the negotiating committee to move this thing forward THEIR way. BUT UFS was cocky and unprepared and they BLEW IT.
NOW? Now, Doug Allen is willing to compromise and send out the contract, NO SAV, after quickly asking the AMPTP if they want to improve anything, in the hope it would pass the simple majority vote when sent out to the membership.
Guess who is trying to stop that?
UFS.
UFS wants to fire Doug Allen, replace the negotiating committee, THEN go to the AMPTP because they somehow think they will get Force Majeure and jurisdiction back.
But the AMPTP will NOT give force majeure and jurisdiction back, because the AMPTP is FREAKED OUT that there WILL be some strike in 2011, they KNOW we won’t all go out together, and when another union goes out, SAG’s force majeure rule kicks in, and they’ll end up owing SAG millions and millions of dollars.(like they do now from the WGA strike: 60 to 100 million and they WON’T pay it!)
UFS is where you should be focusing your anger because what UFS wants is one thing: MERGER WITH AFTRA. They campaigned on it, and that’s why they want control with this razor thin majority, because they want to weaken SAG and quickly merge with AFTRA. THAT’S their plan. They couldn’t give a rat’s ass about the assault on the middle-class actor in this contract or the very existence of SAG itself – because they want to END SAG.
THEN, they have this fantasy, that, somewhere down the line, in some alternate universe, a merged SAG/AFTRA new union would march into the AMPTP offices in 2011 and, because we now have “leverage,” they will GET BACK everything they GAVE AWAY – and ANYONE who knows guild history understands when the AMPTP gets something by contract – something huge (DVD residuals?) THEY NEVER GIVE IT BACK.
So, train your fire where it rightfully belongs: UFS. If not for their inept political grandstanding – this would be over by now.
I have over a great many comments. Although many valid points are raised on both sides, I must say that fault now lies in SAG’s hand for one simple reason: Inability to act as a coherent, UNIFIED body. Period. As a number of people have pointed out, SAG has DONE nothing. Much has been spoken of, and argued over, but nothing has actually been DONE. To me, giving the actual members of SAG a chance to be heard is an excellent idea. Send out the proposed deal, and let’s see how members vote on it. It would, at the very least, tell us where opinions lie. Or is it possible that there are those who fear members’ opinions?
Either way, the lack of decisive, IMMEDIATE action in the wake of such destruction is disgraceful. No more bitching, for either side. It is time for action. Period. Immediately. Put the egos away…
It seems to me that the prudent thing would be to temporarily remove Doug Allen as the lead negotiator, put a new committee together, excluding Rosenberg, and let them have a try at the AMTPT. Then take the results of that negotiations, the results of the failed Rosenberg/Allen negotiations along with a Strike Authorization vote and to the membership and allow the members to decide what road to travel.
@ Summer,
You are a complete fucking idiot. Learn some history.
Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, Adams, — ALL LIBERALS.
Moron.
Hey everybody, Matt Mulhern is back. Yeah! My favorite punching bag! Lets go….
Okay, so first it was AMPTP that was the big monster, then all the “weasel” members who dared to disagree, now UFS, oh and of course Melissa Gilbert…
DAMN YOU MELISSA GILBERT!!! Youve destroyed everything!
How dare anyone disagree with MF. Dont you realize
Matt cannot save his money. He doesnet know how to budget and now he is willing to throw everyone under the bus to make sure he gets his precious money?
Again, just a couple of questions for Matt or anyone else that is pro strike. Have you stopped auditioning? Have you called your agent and said that until a proper contract is in place I will not work. There is no new media covered under the current expired contract, so I imagine that would be a deal breaker for you. RIGHT?
At least all these pro strike people have finally stopped lying and agree that a strike was what they wanted all along. Remeber back when it was just a strike authorization vote. “it doesnt mean there will be a strike”
A quick note to Justine B….hey when was the last time you worked a minimum wage job for $8.00 an hour. YOu have got a lot of nerve bringing that up when I am willing to be you have never worked minimum wage in your life. Futhermore, how unbelieveably rude to all of the hard working people in our society that do. Class act! All the way.
I am willing to bet that there are millions of people that would be happy to get that in these tough times. You know, all the people you are willing to put out of work so you can keep getting above $8.00 an hour. The people that not one of the MF/pro strike faction ever mentions in their posts.
You are all expendable to them. Craft service, suck it. Post people….eat a bag. Matt, Justine, MF need their money and you are all not worth worrying about.
Hey, you could all go work in theatre under a great equity contract and still act and be free of the chains that bind you to hollywood and all the “weasels” that are keeping you down.
hey “ich bin auchein werkunactor”
people working on television right now are seeing the reruns of their shows “moved over”to the internet and instead of receiving $3000
for a single repeat they are being offered $27 for six months unlimited
usage. what do you think that will do to the pension and health funds
in 5 years or so.
i didn’t say a goddamed thing about the AFTRA contract.
got a chip on your shoulder?
we’re talking about the SAG TV/Theatrical contract right now, genius.
the thresholds being proposed by the AMPTP are big enough to drive
a very expensive truck through…they are ludircrous.
it is a template designed to turn the entire industry NON-UNION,
and if you can’t see that, your head is in the sand
or up your ass. which is it?
nice nazi blog name, by the way.
Paris Barclay here.
I have received a number of emails suggesting that I am the “Paris (Not Hilton)” who made the much discussed comments here.
For the record, I am not the commentor. (Or is it commentator?) Either way, to quote Shaggy, “it wasn’t me.”
As a member of SAG, AFTRA, WGA and the First Vice President of the DGA, I have no (public) comment to make on these issues.
To Matt Mulhern: Before UFS even existed, Membership First was already screwing up. I believe that’s why UFS came to be to start with, to answer back to the damage being done by a leadership dominated by MF that was clearly growing reckless. To put this all on UFS is so preposterous as to be laughable. Then again, anyone who reads your posts know that you like to provoke at will, even when it is not based on any truth, which this most certainly is not.
I’ll be voting against the contract and for the strike authorization, if it comes to that.
Why? The contract is not good enough. End of story. That’s all that matters.
“We shall hang together, or hang individually.”
How does SAG wish to swing?
Hey Weasel — why do you brother us with all your BULLSHIT — nobody cares!!
Matt is discussing the current SAG issues — you are talking out your ASS!! You are so hung-up on being right you sound like a crazy person. And like most crazy people, you don’t know how to have a debate.
Get a life — you’ve just wasted 5 seconds of mine . . .
Working actor wrote…
“I’ll be voting against the contract and for the strike authorization, if it comes to that.
Why? The contract is not good enough. End of story. That’s all that matters.”
Yeah, that about says it. It’s really a shame that you can’t see past that. And that, for you, the story ends there.
Well, maybe it’ll go your way and you can witness the consequences of such an additude. And a bunch of people will suffer.
It really truly blows my mind how little sense of responsibility most people have these days. you just want what you want and you go get it and that’s ALL THAT MATTERS.
“people working on television right now are seeing the reruns of their shows “moved over”to the internet and instead of receiving $300″
Right. Obviously the studios are sacrificing lucrative syndication and rerun licensing dollars so they can make a couple thousand off of a single pre-show car add on streaming media. THAT’S THEIR EVIL PLAN. MWAHAHAHAHAHHA.
That, or they’re experimenting with modern shows or unsellable product (i.e. Freddy’s Nightmares) to see what infrastructure can be created with online content that, for now, may break even. Later this could lead to true revenue and then, and only then, will media be “moved over” from the marketplace where all the dollar is being made.
NEXT.
“what do you think that will do to the pension and health funds
in 5 years or so.”
Yes. Obviously in five years, SAG will be completely without any negotiating power because they gave up 3 years on a weaker contract. CLEARLY, they will be unable to get the attention of the other unions, rollbacks will last for infinity (or whatever other nonsensical numbers they’re claiming) and SAG membership will be enslaved at the level of Spartacus, or some such other nonsense.
OF COURSE, SAG must not lose sight of its immediate demands, such as the completely impossible desire to control/approve clip usage ON THE INTERNET, as if this is physical media like DVD. Good god, I can’t wait to see the army of non-existent office staff who are going to cost hundreds of thousands of dollars just to monitor a fraction of this information.
I mean, it’s not like “in 5 years or so” that technology, revenue streams and FLIPPIN’ SAG CONTRACTS will be at a different state. That’s ok, I know your response. IT’S NOW OR WE GET SCREWED FOR INFINITY. WAAAH.
NEXT.
“i didn’t say a goddamed thing about the AFTRA contract.”
Woah there, cowboy. No need for the language.
“got a chip on your shoulder?”
*cough*freudian slip*cough*
“we’re talking about the SAG TV/Theatrical contract right now, genius.”
Actually, there’s a lot being discussed. AFTRA is a pretty big FLIPPIN’ deal, considering that SAG is about to kiss primetime television goodbye for a long time.
“the thresholds being proposed by the AMPTP are big enough to drive
a very expensive truck through…they are ludircrous.
it is a template designed to turn the entire industry NON-UNION,
and if you can’t see that, your head is in the sand
or up your ass. which is it?”
Dude, if you can’t see the giant black limbo that SAG is falling into right now by it’s own hand, I think you should probably start checking other asses.
“nice nazi blog name, by the way.”
GREAT DEBATE SKILLZ, DOOD!
I’m curious.
If there is no contract permitting NBC to rebroadcast your movies on Hulu.com, Why doesn’t someone sue? Wouldn’t that be a positive step in the direction of forcing NBC to negotiate? (and concomitantly, AMPTP?)
There must be a retired Actor who can use the money and won’t be afraid of the AMPTP. Clearly it is, sans contract and payment, illegal to make money from selling commercials on rebroadcast shows. That “Broadcast” decision went all the way through the Supreme Court back when ISPs were so worried about “Content”. It doesn’t matter whether the “Broadcasting” happens over the air, or mountaintop repeaters, or Internet. It is illegal to make money by Broadcasting stuff you don’t own all the “Rights” to, isn’t it?
There are two sides to this Moving-to-the-Internet thing.
Simple question: anti-sag leadership, UFS, USAN, NY, AFTRA huggers, RBD:
what do you want?
this contract says:
1.phase out residuals “somebody” – I’m not sure what you’re talking about, but the main point here is “all content is going to the internet” – so, SAG must tie itself to a floating rate of distributors gross. they make money – we make money – they don’t – we don’t. the whole argument is, once you GIVE THAT UP – that concept, that basic structure and lock yourself in by contract to this formula the suits are proposing: No residuals for original content, tiny residuals for move over, or any re-use for the internet – you’re screwed.
what about that don’t you understand? do you think all content is NOT going to the internet? it’s not so much a question of EXACTLY how long it will take, but the knowledge that it’s already happening and is going to exponentially increase should, if you’re an actor, give you pause. so, that makes the deal we get RIGHT away vital, because the suits have ZERO history of give backs on big ticket items once they get the contract, like with DVD’s – and internet makes DVD look like the unicef change you used to collect on halloween. today? no. tomorrow? no. but – it’s coming and, having announced in the ny times in ‘07 they want to “end residuals” – I for one, take them at their word. don’t you?
2. bye bye clip consent: an actors image is his wallet. if we don’t get substantial protection here, giving in to the excuse that it’s too labor intensive, it SEVERELY undercuts an actors ability, his or her representatives ability, to have much control over the way they are being exposed. you become the victim of a thousand mash-ups and you have no right to fight back. the “boundless sea” of clips you allude to (while in the same breath trivializing the internet as it relates to the current tv and movie model) HAS to be policed in some way, or actors will not be able to have careers without being subject to the whim of people who really have no right to either misuse intellectual property, or just plain yahoo’s with a computer havin’ fun – DOOD!
the burden should be carefully considered – is it the employers obligation to police clips, does it become against federal law, with international law invoked as well, and severely discourage random mash-ups? does the union set up a well-funded task force of geeks that do this 24/7 – responding to complaints? do the studios? I don’t know the exact answer, but I do know it must be slowed down and it must be illegal and it must be subject to oversight, or actors can’t function.
3. new product placement rules for TV and film and YOU’RE in a commercial, whether you like it or not! And – you’re not being paid AND if you refuse you’re fired and if it conflicts with any product you go up for on a commercial audition that you WOULD get paid for – you can’t go up for it!
4. force majeure goes away. protects you in case of natural disasters – fires, floods, hurricanes that can disrupt your job, protects you if another union goes out on strike – as we see right now, sag is owed 60 to 100 million by the amptp because of the writers strike – and they won’t pay it! and the main reason the suits are so hot and bothered about force majeure is, they know the unions won’t line up in 2011 – and when someone goes out before sag – our force majeure rule kicks in – and the money sign stars clicking for sag.
5. a nonunion space in your own contract? under 15k per minute, when the current rate is 2k per minute – you really think , minus union talent and crew, the suits can’t make original content – 1/2 hour, hour, all kinds of ancillary stuff – webisodes, etc., for UNDER 15k a minute – therefore nonunion? of course they can! that’s why the suits are fighting so hard to avoid full jurisdiction. they plan to exploit the living shit out of that space! and the covered performer thing. do you think they went to all this trouble to carve out this nonunion space to constantly be putting covered performers in it and flipping it union? why would they do that?
so, outside of general disgust at the glacial pace and the infighting and they dry up of some jobs right now – what do you want? do you want sag to eat this shit sandwich? do you want ufs to take over so THEY can eat this shit sandwich? (and they will)
outside of “I wanna contract – whaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!”
what the fuck do you want?
Give it a rest boys and girls. It’s time to put up or shut up.
My only question here is this…
Why are there so many of you who don’t even want to let the membership vote? Why are you trying to decide for the members and deny them their right to vote?
Both sides seem to be guilty of this.
Put the contract up to a vote. Be done with the drama. The whole town is tired of watching this vicious, petty “F-U” cycle going on within the SAG board.
somebody,
there was an article in the NY Times in June of 2007, dude, in which
several media moguls were quoted as saying they planned to eliminate
residuals.
and now, dude?
we’re being offered a contract that offers next to nothing in terms
of residuals in new media.
veoh and hulu and the like are now showing product provided to them
by cbs, abc, nbc, etc., making money through paid ads and splitting the $$$ with the providers. and the actors directors and writers of those shows? they get zilch.
“OH! BUT IT”S A NEW FORMAT. THERE’S NO WAY TO KNOW YET IF IT’S
PROFITABLE!!!”
*cough* pile of bullshit*cough*
so let’s take a wild guess and say … YOU’RE NOT AN ACTOR.
clip usage?
an actor’s likeness is all he or she has ultimately, and now the studios want
to be able to use our faces however they want, without consent
for little or no money.
using a person’s likeness without their consent is actually a
violation of California law, dude.
that is unless we GIVE IT AWAY with all of the other things the studios
are demanding in this contract.
the residual thing, dude, is an important step in slowly but surely turning the industry NON-UNION.
IATSE right now is probably going to vote down the shit deal
they’ve just been offered.
the AMPTP is out to eliminate organized labor in the industry. period.
and people who don’t want to hear it say, “Well, we’d never let that happen.” well, it’s happening
wow! the AFTRA thing is a big deal, huh?
ask any actor what contracts ( and i know you’ll say, but SAG doesn’t have a contract) have been more lucrative for them,
and they’ll tell you SAG, every time.
if AFTRA winds up taking over the whole ball of wax, i hope
their future dealings with the AMPTP will consist of something other
than the, “Sure, whatever you say. We’ll take the deal.” strategy.
“do you want sag to eat this shit sandwich?”
Short answer? Yes.
Long answer? How about you choose a FLIPPIN’ sandwich and stick to it. Right now SAG reminds me of my 6 year old sister crying and screaming in line at the restaurant because she doesn’t want to make a choice about what she wants. SAG NEEDS TO STOP WHINING AND DO SOMETHING., THEY ARE LITERALLY RUINING PEOPLE’S LIVES.
Furthermore, Matt, if you want me to take a mogul’s statements as representative of the overall plan that the studios have to eliminate residuals, then you’re going to lose a lot of people outright… including me.
If we’re going to play the “evil plan” game, then I can come at you just as strong for the total BS that Doug Allen has been serving for months regarding the impact of the strike and his completely intentional misinformation regarding the GCC’s. I don’t believe a word this guy says at this point, but I’m more than willing to believe a lot of SAG membership is going to get hurt by the deal and not all of them are as mindlessly selfish as most of the pro-SAG posts I see on this site.
You and I both know that this industry cannot survive if people can’t make the living to fill the jobs, evidenced by what’s going on right now. That means that residuals will have to be reworked to fit the new business models for SAG, WGA and DGA, but the problem is that the model does not yet exist. The marketplace is not there and the argument that does is mostly semantics.
Some of SAG’s demands, no matter how reasonable THE FEARS, are unreasonable in their application. Making matters worse, there are too many problems clouding the dialogue that should be happening to smooth out this slow transition (AND IT IS SLOW), ranging from internal union politics to a nationwide financial crisis. Are the AMPTP being stingy bastards who don’t care about anything but the bottom line? YES!
That’s no excuse to shoot the industry in the head at one of the worst times in recent economic history WHEN SAG DOESNT EVEN HAVE A PLAN. Do I hate SAG? No. Do I despise those who blindly wave around phrases like “Now or never” or “No residuals for 50 years now!”? YES.
I’m responding to you because I can clearly tell you’re not an idiot. I feel sorry for everyone who is going to see revenue they believe is due go on hold or disappear in the short term, but the AMPTP won’t be able to get anywhere if everyone unites and goes at them in 3 years. Meanwhile, SAG needs to get their shit together, repair their relationship with AFTRA and choose what they want to fight for.
Residuals? Makes sense to me. Clip usage? I work in a field that deals with this, and the desire to control ones’ likeness is irrelevant if it completely denies the reality of the technology, legal work and necessary means of communicating approvals. The reason for the demand comes from the right place, but it’s still completely unreasonable.
The Internet is an instantaneous medium and if the industry tries to regulate it at the level SAG demands, the technology and consumer demand (i.e. piracy) will completely outpace the market and leave everyone in the business without a semblance of control. We need to figure out how it works before we throw shackles over everything.
You have every right to be passionate Matt and I don’t disagree with all your qualms, but people like Harry98 are doing nothing to offer political/commercial discourse and its the hilariously inane ramblings of just finger pointing, paranoia and generalizations that’s going to keep you guys divided and on the verge of splitting your union apart. It would be a shame if that happens, but that’s where this is going if patience and focus don’t appear soon.
helen of peel,
by all means, let’s send out the AMPTP’s offer and let
membership vote it up or down.
i will be voting it down. it’s un-signable.
my feeling is that the U4S/USAN coalition is afraid that there are alot of
members who feel as i do and the damn thing might very well be voted down.
then what? then maybe we would have to put politics aside and work
together as a union, however we may feel about one another.
Well, I was fortunate to be one of the observers at last Thursday’s Hollywood Board meeting. Unlike the other divisions, Hollywood board meetings are open to members in good standing. Back in 2006 MembershipFirst demanded that Hollywood board meetings be more public and they made it happen. No other SAG division has followed that example. Anyway… a MF board member made the motion to support Doug Allen and his compromise. (sending out the June 30th deal from the AMPTP). There was lengthy debate from both sides. Everyone had the opportunity to share their opinion and ask questions. Doug Allen was there to answer any question. And he did. None of it was held in executive session. After everyone who cared to had the chance to speak and/or ask questions, it was brought to a vote. A roll call vote was requested. The final vote was 24 “yes” to 14 “no”. No one from UFS voted for the compromise. Not one. And although there has been resent conflicts within MF, all MF board members who attended voted up the compromise. So, really, WTF!? UFS first votes up sending out the strike authorization in Oct, then they immediately join the New York Board to launch a public campaign against a strike authorization. Then two UFS board members, Ned Vaughn and Adam Arkin request a meeting with Doug Allen to discuss the confusion surrounding the strike authorization, Doug agrees to move up the date of the already scheduled January plenary to talk about those who want to reconsider their Oct. vote, but what actually happened is that UFS, NY, and the RBD hi-jacked the meeting and turned it into a tar and feather session against Doug Allen and the negotiating committee. When they failed that attempt because they were just not experienced enough to go up against the MF minority, they, at the last minute, had Gabrielle C., (the person known for wanting to weaken SAG in order to expedite a quickie merger with AFTRA), pass around a piece a paper, requesting signatures from New York and RBD members without telling them exactly what they were signing ( it turned out to be a really poorly executed written assent, which was deemed not worth the paper it was written on by both inside and outside SAG lawyers), and now this unknown majority has sent a letter to the media,yet not to anyone at the Guild, demanding Doug Allen’s head. Have you noticed that there are NO signatures attached to that letter!? Why don’t these people sign this letter? And why did they send it to the media without sending it to the Guild? The same media that announced on the 12th that Doug Allen had been fired when he hadn’t. (how is it that Dave McNary still has a job?)
Make no mistake. The AMPTP could give a flying you know what about who sits opposite them during negotiations. If UFS truly believes that they can find someone who can actually convince the AMPTP to give SAG full jurisdiction in all production made for New Media, residuals in that platform and retaining Force Majeure and honoring the hundreds of thousands of dollars still owed to SAG members due to the WGA strike then why don’t they reveal who that person is? Because it certainly isn’t John McGuire. He’s been sitting third chair during these negotiations since April 15th, 2008 and supports Doug and the negotiating committee. It certainly can’t be Steve Diamond. Anyone who’s read his tirades must realize the man sounds like a jilted lover. Who is this powerful person UFS has waiting in the wings? Short of Barack Obama, it better be someone who can really intimidate Counter and his gang.
The reality is that they have no one. They, along with Jamie Cromwell et al want to destroy SAG. Plain and simple. Merger, merger, merger. Remember during the last SAG elections, UFS campaigned on a merger platform yet never revealed their plan. Well, here it is. We are all witnessing their plan. That’s why they were furious with the Vote No campaign SAG waged against AFTRA’s primetime tentative agreement. That’s it in a nutshell. They want to merge with AFTRA with AFTRA taking the lead in our contracts and our careers!!
Oh, hey, what happened to all of the blt’ers telling us actors to just shut up and take the damn deal on this site? Did they actually take their fingers out of their ears and hands away from blocking their eyes, to actually read that piece of shit their leadership is begging them to accept? If you haven’t done so already, please go to http://www.400hours.com. It’s worth a few minutes of your time.
I’m a WGA member and impartial observer (as much as anyone can be impartial having felt the full brunt of the AMPTP during our own go-round).
Matt Mulhern sure takes a lot of flack on this site. Yet consistently, in post after post, he sticks to the issues, lays out his argument, and defends his positions.
As opposed to most of his detractors, who namecall and speak in generalities. I’d say 5% of the posts blasting Mulhern even bother to present any argument at all, much less refute Mulhern’s specific points.
Tell me why the guy’s wrong — that’s how you change minds. Not by ranting about Membership First, or the Allens, or the failing economy.
The AMPTP wants everything and gives away nothing — ever. They respect strength, and nothing else.
Frank
“They, along with Jamie Cromwell et al want to destroy SAG.”
So much for any credability to your argument. A huge post that I wanted to take seriously drowned out by more angry, fear-filled paranoia and character assassination. GOOD JOB, DOOD.
“Furthermore, Matt, if you want me to take a mogul’s statements as representative of the overall plan that the studios have to eliminate residuals, then you’re going to lose a lot of people outright… including me.”
I’d be thrilled if someone would explain that statement to me “Top Hollywood Executives Want to End Residuals” from Aug. ‘07 in the NY Times. Now, we see them trying to do it,and this guy says the above…
Um, “somebody?” I’d go with the top moguls statements if I were you, as being representative of an industry wide approach. You know, because they are THE TOP MOGULS.
And, “somebody” – the difficulty with the charges of character assassination towards Jamie Cromwell is: HE SAID IT IN PUBLIC.
So did Gabrielle Carteris of UFS.
I repeat: IN PUBLIC.
Their “plan” is to “weaken SAG to merge with AFTRA”
There are a LOT of people in SAG who aren’t going to lay down for that. Witness last week’s national board meeting. Sorry trying to save the union is inconveniencing you. It’s inconveniencing a lot of people, but the POINT is, it wouldn’t be happening if:
A. the AMPTP wasn’t offering this unsignable deal
and
B. UFS/RBD/USAN/NY and “the stars” could find their nads and saddle up to STOP IT.
Instead, we’ve got numb-skulls trying to tear the union apart. Like this fool from Chicago who announced(!?) from his position as “some guy from Chicago” yesterday that he “demanded (!) Doug Allen resign!” This dude, Todd Hissong has NOT ONE SINGLE TV/THEATRICAL CREDIT, same as Paul Christie from NY, who is blathering on about Doug being thrown out and HE HAS NO CREDITS – he’s a fucking voice over guy! They HAVE a great union – AFTRA!
These fools need to be kicked to the curb, period. Send out the damn contract, UFS shut the fuck up, and LET THE MEMBERSHIP VOTE.
Is ANYBODY PISSED OFF AT THESE FOOLS? We’d be announcing the results of an SAV FRIDAY if not for their bullshit.
somebody,
if you have a six year old sister, then you must be 25 or 26 at the very oldest.
so, your imparting your pearls of wisdom based on your many, many years in the business?
this isn’t the debate club and we’re not attending a forensics meet.
we’re talking about people’s livelihoods.
you’re obviously bright and you write well and
YOU’RE NOT AN ACTOR.
the ’shackles’ that you claim we’re trying to throw over new media
is a simple percentage system.
the studios make some money, SAG actors make a little bit of money.
but they’re trying to lock us into flat fees that they will never change
short of a massive industry wide strike that, people who’ve been out of college for more than 4 years and have actual experience in this business will tell you has little or no chance of happening.
see we learned our lesson on DVD’ when the suits said,
” just agree to this lowball formula now so we can get it up and running
and then we can revisit this later in success.”
and every time we brought up the fact that DVD’s were successful
and we wanted to revisit the issue, we were told, politely,
to go fuck ourselves.
and just so we all know, what exactly is the field you work in that deals with clip usage?
harry98 said “then maybe we would have to put politics aside and work together as a union, however we may feel about one another.”
The fact that days after this was posted the same people are yelling at each other with the same issues clearly shows how divided we are. Politics are a 2 way street and the facts are that MF and U4S and ALL SAG members are highly divided.
Unless SOMEONE can BRING US TOGETHER we are DOOMED. We have no strength. We have no leverage. We have NOTHING.
I am sick and tired of the fighting. We will NEVER, EVER, EVER get anything done if this contiues. A strike authorization IS IMPOSSIBLE while we are divided.
STOP IT!!! WISE UP AND STOP FIGHTING WITH EACH OTHER!!!! GET A !@#$@$% CLUE AND COME UP WITH SOMETHING THAT A MAJORITY OF SAG MEMBERS CAN GET BEHIND.
I really don’t give a damn who does it. MF, U4S, USAN or Bozo the Clown! Unless the BOARD can work together WE ARE DOOMED FOREVER. Unless everyone on this board can turn this into a CONSTRUCTIVE CONVERSATION ABOUT WHAT TO DO NEXT, we are doomed as well.
Put the rhetoric, infighting, hatred, paranoia, fear and all other hurt feelings aside and SUCK IT UP! The more we fight, the more the AMPTP wins and the more actors lose.
No need for “SAG to get a clue” and “figure out what members will vote for”, Mr. Limbo Again.
It’s all very simple. Trust the membership. Put the contract out for a vote. Easy.
Unless you’re afraid you won’t like the answer.
It’s time to vote. Quit trying to “massage” this to come out all nice and pretty.
Democracy is not pretty. Never was. Never will be. But it’s the best we got, so get on with it.
Let the membership vote. Now.
“And, “somebody” – the difficulty with the charges of character assassination towards Jamie Cromwell is: HE SAID IT IN PUBLIC.”
Matt, I can’t take you seriously when you keep making these statements and either A) wait until you’re called on it to set the context for your statements or B) don’t provide links or quotes. I am completely open to learning something that I missed, but so far all I see is lots of declarations with holes in its supporting arguments. Please, by all means show me and stop telling me.
I will tell you what I DO see. I see Cromwell putting his face on ads in consideration for below-the-line employment and meeting face-to-face with fellow SAG members during events to have down to Earth conversations about the state of the industry. I see Doug Allen intentionally misleading membership regarding GCC’s and misappropriating the larger fears of the community (i.e. “industry will NOT shut down”) to stretch the truth and meet HIS agenda.
“if you have a six year old sister, then you must be 25 or 26 at the very oldest.
so, your imparting your pearls of wisdom based on your many, many years in the business?”
I was referring to over 20 years ago, but I thought it would be funnier if I left out the past tense and wide open for cheap shots. Your inability to form complete sentences or use punctuation wasn’t funny enough anymore. I’m glad you won’t let me down when I need you.
“The fact that days after this was posted the same people are yelling at each other with the same issues clearly shows how divided we are. Politics are a 2 way street and the facts are that MF and U4S and ALL SAG members are highly divided.
Unless SOMEONE can BRING US TOGETHER we are DOOMED. We have no strength. We have no leverage. We have NOTHING.”
THANK YOU. For starters, why not get the ball rolling on letting the members decide. ON ANYTHING. Do I trust Allen? No. But that doesn’t pit me against the entire guild. I want to see their votes. Strike. No strike. Contract. No contract. JUST VOTE!
Studios shooting pilots on High Def, Businesses closing, projects dry docked everywhere, budget cuts all over (ask anyone who is working), 800 layoffs at the WB and many more to come.
At still we have SAG unable to figure it out. This is equivalent to the buggy makers union threatening a strike
as Henry Ford opened his first factory. If you doubt what I’m pointing out, how about spending some time with people outside your profession.
End this stupidity NOW!!!!
Hey somebody and anonymous- You’re full of crap. Matt and the so called “militants” keep trying to have a dialoug about the issues and all you have are flip answers like “SAG NEEDS TO STOP WHINING AND DO SOMETHING., THEY ARE LITERALLY RUINING PEOPLE’S LIVES” If anybodys ruining lives it’s the Studios. Everyone of them just had a record breaking profits year and theyre cuting jobs left and right to help cover the losses of their global parent companies that are in the red. Just because they’re shooting everyone else doesn’t mean I’m good with being shot. And if Cromwell is so coincerned about BTLers he ought to be urging them to vote down the 400hour contract management is offering them. That contract is going to be the end of their ability to qualify for their own healthcare plan and the end of their P&H.
Anonymous
James Cromwell said it to Dave Clennon. If you Google Dave, I think he’s got his own site due to all this crap.
Gabrielle Carteris was overheard telling another member the same thing at a Hollywood Town Hall.
I can’t tell you the source for that, but you might want to do a little homework of your own.
Cromwell tellin’ it like it is to the SAG and below the line folks, eh?
You also might want to do a little research into Jamie Cromwell. He has a long, long history on the “merger solves everything” side of this problem. Again, you might want to do a little homework of your own. I’m sure Jamie would deign to talk to you. Write what he says down, and then call up or meet with a top SAG official – they’ll SHOW you he’s full of shit and why.
He knew the response (”Save the biz Redux”)to his rather ornate “video” was coming, but now he’s gotten it pulled off Youtube and everywhere else due to “copyright infringement” Now, that smells of insecurity to me. You’re going to claim “copyright infringement” rather than letting your video speak for itself and allowing the opposition to respond? Weak. You might want to look into what the response actually said, and then check out THOSE predictions, claims and facts.
And the very idea – the absolute nuts Cromwell’s got, to call the video “Save the biz” when he’s actively campaigning, and has been for years to destroy SAG! He wants to weaken it, in his OWN words “to make it easier to merge with AFTRA.”
So, it’s about “the biz” in this time of blatant assault on the Screen Actors Guild, NOT about “how do I help the union that has been so good to me now that it’s being attacked?”
If Jamie Cromwell had an ounce of sauce, he’d tear up his SAG card and put his money where his mouth is – “you want to destroy SAG Jamie? You want to ‘merge with AFTRA?’ O.K. – well, ALL these films you’ve been SO FORTUNATE to get to do in the last fifteen years – every single one, has been a SAG show. How much did YOU personally, Jamie, benefit from that? You don’t want to support that union?
Then get the fuck out.
18 years ago, I was walking to lunch with a friend on the Universal lot. She saw some tall thin guy and called out “Jamie?”
We both walk over. They know each other somehow – class, a job, somewhere. I’ve never seen the guy in my life. It’s Jamie Cromwell.
“What are you doing?” she says.
He shrugs “Auditioning.”
“What are you up to?”
Aah, who knows. I’m going back to New York.”
“Why?”
He shrugs “I don’t know.”
“Well, good to see you – and good luck Jamie” The guy smiles weakly and walks away. I don’t need to even discuss it – “actor going nowhere, thinking of getting the fuck out of the business, doesn’t know if he’s coming or going.”
But Jamie gets a goofy job as a pig farmer in some goofy movie about a pig, flies to Australia, shoots the thing, realizing it’s not going to amount to jack-shit, but happy to have a job, a SAG job, by the way, and – surprise!
James Cromwell has a career. Must have been 50 at the time. And ALL done on SAG movies, with SAG benefits and protections, wages and residuals.
Thanks Jamie. Thanks a lot.Your fellow SAG members thank you for wanting to destroy the union. And what REALLY gets me is, Ned Vaughn, and all these other yahoos? This is their whole thing – their WHOLE plan – MERGE WITH AFTRA. Instead of understanding THIS contract is the most vital contract facing the Screen Actor Guild, arguably EVER – they start a slate that isn’t so much concerned about the contract – at least it’s not their FIRST priority. Priority 1 though, oh, 5 is MERGE WITH AFTRA. Not THIS contract. Why? Because they think merger will solve everything, that the AMPTP will cower in fear if SAG merges with AFTRA – which is utterly ridiculous – and they actually think “eh, THIS contract? Less important than the BIG picture – merger.” They somehow think if they pull merger off, they can turn back the clock and recover all the shit they are FALLING over each other to give away NOW – stuff EXPONENTIALLY more important than going down the fucking merger road again – for the 17TH TIME IN SAG HISTORY – AND THEY ARE 0 FOR 17!
That means some other, third entity, that no longer reps Screen Actors, but Screen Actors, Broadcasters and Recording Artists in three separate “silo’s” overseen by an “umbrella” board, with important decisions, such as whether to strike or not, not CLEARLY left up to the SAG branch alone. Why? Because if SAG goes out – AIMA (the name they proposed in ‘98 – and from what I hear, what they plan on going with)- AIMA goes out – meaning all three silos. Or, say, the other two don’t want much to do with SAG, once joined at the hip? Rather different disciplines, wouldn’t you say? Well, then, it’s too late – we’re stuck. The “moderates” are always screaming it will give us “leverage” but, even though AFTRA contains actors, it contains a lot of other disciplines too, ones that probably won’t share our needs, or fit with our general culture. But the “moderates” say we’re all “performers” and that calling US actors is denying the legitimacy of these other “performers.” Well, of course, that’s complete horseshit – more power to ‘em, I just don’t see the point of being in a union, in ANY WAY subject to the whim of a guy who does NOTHING but voice-overs for a living, or a newsreader, or a recording artist.
Rather than spread OUT into a more diffuse union, we should be focused on SCREEN ACTORS — that IS the name of the damn thing, and WHY it was organized in 1937.
Yes, we absorbed background actors, but, I’d rather deal with that, which we do just fine, minus this constant drumbeat to “merge for leverage.”
The whole thing is nuts, and the WHOLE thing – UFS’s agenda, as well as the RBD/USAN,NY dissent is directed towards that goal – merge. Why? Because all these other folks want the benefits of the Screen Actors Guild – it’s strength, it’s resources, it’s power.
AFTRA is CONSTANTLY fighting off insolvency, hence the poaching, the under-mining of SAG contracts – they’re just looking to stay afloat, and they’ll do basically anything to keep their heads above water. Are they going to profit from SAG’s current crisis? Sure, they will. How much? Don’t know. but everybody should take note WHY they betrayed SAG, ran and made a quickie deal with the AMPTP, which wouldn’t have given a rat’s ass if AFTRA stamped its feet and tried to get a better one – because the suits knew AFTRA had a ridiculously small amount of jurisdiction and no bargaining power as a result.
But, now? Now AFTRA is trying to make hay while the sun shines at SAG’s expense, instead of hanging in there WITH us as they’d AGREED to do in front of the President of the AFL-CIO, John Sweeney, to continue 27 straight years of Phase 1 bargaining. This time? AFTRA saw the writing on the wall – knew it would be a tough, tough fight, and did what they always do – they caved, and ran to the AMPTP so they could get started organizing as many shows as they could before SAG got a contract. Nice, huh?
That’s AFTRA for you, in a nutshell.
hey anonymous who used to be somebody,
This is blog, not a term paper.
I’ll bet you got straight A’s, huh?
Perfect marks for punctuation an syntax,
but CONTENT? Not so much.
What is this job youhave that deals with clip
usage? Are you a memberof Aftra? Or Sag?
Got some tech day job? Good for you.
Now you’re saying send out the contract
and let the members decide?
Go back through my posts on this thread and
notice that’s what I’ve been advocating.
Sag has to unite and we need to open
a dialogue with Aftra, but Aftea has to be willing.
And the whole, ” I intentionally left out the
past tense thing regarding my 6 year old sister
so you would gal into my trap ” thing?
Weak, dumb backpedaling.
Soon as this is all over, you all will be rubbin elbows, grabbin for the same nuts on the craft service table. Everybody- take a deep breath.
God bless ya Mr. Mulhern, but you are crackers. James Cromwell got somewhere in this business by his own hard work, unique talent, and persistance. It’s truly great that SAG was there for him and we are honored to be a part of his career.
And by the way, this bashing of AFTRA is coming at an awfully odd time, now that they’ve outplayed us and will likely be back in complete control of television within the next year or so. Mr. Cromwell is right, a merger is a good idea, but it’s hard to imagine AFTRA getting excited about it.
Don’t mean to burst anyone’s bubble but no guild in this business wants to negotiate with SAG. They think we have our heads up our asses. And they’re right, sadly. I’ve seen a lot of people on this posting board talking about waiting until the next negotiation and then going in with the WGA, AFTRA, DGA, whatever. I think it’s a great idea (who wouldn’t?) but do not count on anyone wanting to have us on their team, particularly after this round. For a few reasons why…read all of Nikki’s posts about our union for the past year. What little leverage we had at the beginning we completely, COMPLETELY squandered. Now? We have essentially none.
And yet the endless blather goes on…hatred for UFS, MF, this deal point, that deal point, the AMPTP, AFTRA, DGA, the Allens…blah blah blah…
Total self-involvement…total amateurs.
love’s labors lost,
jamie cromwell is very talented. and with all due respect, so what?
any of us who live in NY or LA can pretty much walk out our front door,
throw a rock in any direction and hit someone with acting talent.
some a little more, some a little less. what separates the working actors from many who are merely aspiring?
LUCK. a lucky break. cromwell’s was playing second fiddle to a pig.
then after about thirty years as an actor, people finally realized
how good cromwell is. and all of the things that previously held him back, like his towering height, were now an asset.
we work in “The anything can happen business.”
no one is doubting, or casting aspersions on cromwell’s talent.
his dad was a famous director, so maybe jamie feels like he came from
hollywood royalty and now he’s finally risen to the top, where he feels
he should have been from the beginning. i have no idea.
i am constantly amazed at how people who have struggled for years
in the working and middle classes suddenly become high and mighty
when they make a few bucks.
“I have all the answers, because I’m rich.”
if jamie was still depending on residuals from “Mama’s Family”,
perhaps he’d view this AMPTP offer differently.