Comments (15)

• If Adam Arkan runs and becomes SAG’s next President, it is clear that he will follow the David White/John McGuire agenda and destroy all that SAG has represented for the past 76 years.
  He,like the rest of United for Strength and their shadow governement AFTRA,, represents corporate control and what amounts to power to a few over the many.
  With a knee jerk merger to a sister union that has foundered financially for years and has done all it can to weaken the bargaining power of SAG, the ACTOR’S UNION and iall it’s achieved will become history.

  Comment by Michael Bell — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 8:09am PST  Reply to this post

• Michael, It it the manner of the agenda put forward by you and Membership First that is destroying this great Union. De-leveraging was brought about by the attempted destruction of our relationship with AFTRA, as well as a go it alone policy. The mantra that AFTRA is broke is tiresome and ridiculous. Prove it. Wake up. 70% of Hollywood’s voting membership said enough already. Time to move on and seek solidarity, not fragmentation. You’re living in a time gone past. Let the younger generation who now have a vested interest in the future of our careers and of our unions move the debate forward.

  Comment by william Charlton — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 10:13am PST  Reply to this post

• William,

  Some of us voted yes because we knew this game had no due to the ridiculous and open takeover of the Guild. We voted no while holding our noses at the disgusting tactics employed by men like Arkin.

  So, please do not throw that 70% number around as if every person approved. It’s not a mandate for anything.

  It just means we were tired.

  I have nothing but hatred for Arkin, AFTRA and their kind.

  Comment by Working actor — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 12:58pm PST  Reply to this post

• William Charlton.

  You know what 78%, now that the dust has begun to settle, really means? NOTHING. “PUNT!” That’s what it means. Everything you say, has an inverse that makes a helluva lot more sense, However, this contract and its ramifications were simply too huge, given the new media importance and the re-alignment of the entire business, for the former OR current leadership of SAG to survive. SAG was, in a word, overwhelmed, and lost, and lost badly. And the message that was sent to the AMPTP was one word : WEAK.

  Unwilling to even THREATEN to strike to protect ourselves, our residuals(against a “core principal” of the union, that “all work will be subject to payments for reuse [residuals] in ANY medium” – WRITTEN by Masur!) our clip consent rights, our product placements protections, force majeure, held formerly as a collective bargaining right since the 1930’s (!), allowing a nonunion space in our OWN contract – for the first time in the HISTORY OF SAG (!) against, AGAIN, a “core principal” of the union WRITTEN by Masur – the Queen of the “moderates” (all of a sudden, they became “core suggestions”).

  Charlton is a predictable pro-merger shill who supposedly “lost his house” in the commercial strike of 2000, and has held MF or “hard-liners” responsible ever since. His words are driven by hatred and revenge and bile, period. If it’s MF, or a tough negotiating stance that even SMELLS of having to strike, Bill Charlton and his ilk pull out the “moderate” playbook, and we end up with things like the DISASTER of a contract we just signed.

  My guess is, by 2011, it will be CRYSTAL CLEAR exactly HOW the AMPTP is pushing the envelope on the new media provisions of this pig we just voted up, and then, SAG will once again have at least a SHOT at self-preservation: consolidate ALL actors under SAG, go in, in 2011 or 2014 with SAV IN HAND BEFORE YOU EVEN SAY HELLO, and COMPLETELY overturn this shit sandwich people like Bill Charlton just voted for, to get the “you make money, we make money” new media deal we should have gotten in June 2008.

  SAG is well and truly fucked by the “moderates” who ended up not even being allowed to SURRENDER for months after their little “written assent” coup which removed all hope of strong representation for SAG.

  And, they’ll push for a “merged SAG and AFTRA” – seemingly unaware that the supposed “leverage” merger will bring will, once again be LAUGHED at by the AMPTP, because the producers KNOW now, beyond the shadow of a doubt: merged, not merged, whatever, the Richard Masur’s and the Bill Charlton’s and the Ned Vaughn’s and the Adam Arkin’s and the James Cromwell’s and the Mike Farrell’s and the Keri Tomabazian’s and the Amy Aquino’s will take ANYTHING and fight for NOTHING. They are WEAK, GUTLESS, COWARDS – and SAG members, who will see their incomes start to drop like a fucking stone due to move-over and new media original production rules in this new contract, will wake up to the reality that they just signed both their present and their future away, and ONLY strength from a new group of people, ready and willing to both threaten to strike AND strike if necessary, will even BEGIN to undo the damage this contract we just signed has done.

  Comment by Matt Mulhern — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 3:44pm PST  Reply to this post

• http://unionunderground.org/2008/06/11/pension-problems-2/ – is where you’ll find out about AFTRA and ERISA. A simple Google search using “AFTRA”, “PENSION” & “IRS” should do the trick. Yes it was from a year ago. Yes, it isn’t pretty.

  Comment by Ace — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 6:18pm PST  Reply to this post

• There are a lot of angry losers (see above) who still don’t understand the way the industry is working and currently hurting. They actually think “new media” is thriving when it’s hurting worst of all. Morons all.

  Alan Arkin has my vote. Bravo! SAG could use less idiocracy and more clear thinking. And yes, I hate AFTRA too, which is why we need to absorb them, since we can’t destroy them. Only then will actors speak with one voice in negotiations, regardless of the leadership.

  Comment by Scott Barry — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 8:28pm PST  Reply to this post

• That article was posted on that website a year ago, but described a situation that occured SIX years ago. It does say 2003, right in the article, Ace.

  As it turns out, the IRS eventually turned down the request for the extension because they determined it wasn’t necessary to protect the interests of the AFTRA plan participants. In other words, the AFTRA plan was healthy enough under the existing rules not to require the extension. This of course, proves the IRS didn’t share your worries about the financial condition of the AFTRA Retirement Plan, but you’ve never been one to let facts get in the way of a good complaint, especially when you can pretend old news is really current news, and really, really incoherent “analysis” is relevant.

  Comment by Puzzled again — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 8:42pm PST  Reply to this post

• “Puzzled Again”

  That is complete and utter bullshit about the ERISA request. AFTRA was SCREWED in terms of their pension plan, and they asked for a 25 YEAR EXTENSION on having to meet the federal requirements for pension funding, and they were turned DOWN by the IRS, who saw their books and knew they were in serious trouble. Period. Please don’t twist yourself into a pretzel pretending that asking the IRS for a 25 YEAR EXTENSION to get your pension books in order is a good thing.

  And Scott Barry. YOU are a moron. New media is a HUGE landscape waiting to be filled in with a coherent and reliable business model. The fact that it is in it’s infancy, relatively speaking now, and the endless quoting from “yes” people that it “isn’t making any money” and therefor we don’t need a fair deal, and it was O.K. to give the AMPTP the roll-backs and give-aways we just SHOWERED them with in new media, does NOT mean we should NOT have fought as hard as necessary, that WHATEVER the new media landscape turns into, WHENEVER it starts to return a reliable, then, probably multi-billion dollar return, for the entertainment corporations – SAG HAD to lock in a “you make money, we make money” new media deal. SAG didn’t. And by codifying these shit terms, and relying on a “sunset clause” with NO force of law, which means the AMPTP doesn’t have to change ONE DAMN THING in 2011 if they don’t want to, as well as “union solidarity” – a completely unprecedented FANTASY where the “moderates” tell us ALL the creative unions will strike with SAG in 2011 to get BACK what we just gave away? The DGA wouldn’t piss on SAG if it was on fire. Plus, many of them are producers. Think they’ll look at the beginnings of huge savings by NOT paying actors subject to the crap terms of this 2009 contract, and then STRIKE WITH SAG in 2011 to give that money BACK TO ACTORS? That’s the DEFINITION OF STUPIDITY.

  Neither, at this point, would AFTRA, and vice – versa. The WGA? maybe, but a LOT of questions as to where they’ll be in terms of THEIR best interests in 2011.

  This whole “PUNT – and fight back in 2011″ BULLSHIT that was fed a bunch of scared, tired, worn-out actors, who hated the OLD leadership for no results and the NEW leadership for getting the SAME, and arguably WORSE deal the old leadership was offered in June 2008? THERE’S your 78%.

  And now? Now, we all get to feel in our wallets what weak leadership will mean: a Darwinian mass thinning of the herd. Actors will not be able to make it, and will say “fuck it – I’m done” and go back to Tuscon to work in their brother’s shoe store. They won’t qualify for health for themselves and their families, they won’t get pension credits because they won’t be making enough money, in short, the acting profession, as bad as it already WAS to make a living? Just DIED with this vote. The only actors making it, will be actors who hook into series recurring and regular roles and can rely on their salaries. Movies? forget it. If you aint the star? Scale plus 10 baby. And the 95% of the union that was ABLE to get through due to residuals? Kiss ‘em goodbye. They are going to move-over, no rerun and straight to the net with no residuals. And what residuals there ARE in this contract? Are MICROSCOPIC. It’s already happening. Shows are not being run either AT ALL or, a fraction of the network and cable runs that brought us all those checks we EARNED. Thank UFS, the NY and RBD and USAN for the “new” SAG, where we all “get back to work!” because we just voted up this shit sandwich “with pride.”

  Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb. Dumb.

  Here comes the other shoe. By 2011 “moderates” may need armed guards.

  Comment by Matt Mulhern — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 10:11pm PST  Reply to this post

• @ Puzzled… First of all, I merely added a link to an article which was presented a year ago (and said so), which referenced something that happened to/with AFTRA in the past. That the problem was brought to light only six years ago (and settled… when? When was “eventually”?) wasn’t relevant of my notation, nor did I say it was. But to that point, does anybody think for a second that any funds are better off today than they were five or six years ago – with the current economical crisis?

  I wasn’t stating facts – only offering suggestions for anyone who wants to know about AFTRA’s historical financial situation to SEARCH THE INTERNET FOR IT. It’s there, in all of cyberspace’s glory.

  And what is your response? To take cheap shots at me personally and to suggest that I don’t base my comments on facts. To the contrary, I do my due diligence and come to my opinions from what information I gather. Unlike so many SAG members, who drank the U4S Kool-Aid and (supposedly) said ‘YES’ to this recent contract ratification. You don’t know me, “Puzzled Again” and your slurs show as much about the problems and divisiveness within SAG as about you, personally.

  If AFTRA is doing well, let’s see it. Let’s get some hard facts and information on how their pension is doing today, and what the federal government and ERISA is allowing with regards to that issue. I would LOVE to see it. This is a HUGE roadblock with regards to a merger and you’d think that AFTRA would be doing everything it can to allay those fears if they are, in fact, unfounded.

  Is AFTRA giving up that information? NOPE.

  @ Scott Barry: Alan Arkin isn’t running for SAG President. Neither is his son, Adam, as this subject originally was pretty clear on. So… they don’t get your vote after all. (You wanna vote for an Arkin and you claim to “hate AFTRA”?) Now just sit there quietly in the corner and sip your cup of Kool-Aid.

  P.S. @ Scott: if you think that ANYONE from the ‘VOTE YES’ contingency is or was claiming that “new media is thriving”, then you’ve totally missed the point. And then you claim that New Media is “hurting worst of all”. Who’s the moron there, sparky? Glad you voted ‘YES’. You’re the poster-child for the ‘Vote YES’ contingency.

  Comment by Ace — Thursday June 18, 2009 @ 10:33pm PST  Reply to this post

• Michael Bell is right about Adam Arkin and Unite for Strength. (My only quibble: “their shadow government AFTRA.” Needs to be clarified.)

  Adam sold out his own father by shilling for the TV/Film contract. When “The Russians Are Coming” and “Catch-22″ are exploited on the Internet, Alan Arkin won’t see a cent in residuals, because they are pre-’71 films.

  Thanks, Adam.

  Maybe Alan doesn’t need those residuals to get by, but plenty of other actors do.

  Adam deprives his father’s contemporaries of income, and another poster here dismisses Mike Bell as too old to have a voice in union matters.

  He gives Bell the back of his hand, with these words: “Time to move on … You’re living in a time gone past. Let the younger generation, who now have a vested interest … move the debate forward.”

  That’s the kind of cold-blooded Masurism I’ve seen before from U4S and USAN.

  Ned Vaughn was asked about the morality of depriving actors of residuals for older films and television.

  Ned said, “I’m not comfortable with that.”

  Not comfortable. But he was comfortable enough to go right on promoting that contract.

  Cold.

  Comment by Dave Clennon — Friday June 19, 2009 @ 12:14am PST  Reply to this post

• From the mind of Scott Barry:

  “A lot of angry losers … Morons all. Alan Arkin has my vote. Bravo!”

  You mean your WRITE-in vote?

  Haste makes stupid. Bravo!

  Losers? Yeah, we lost, we ALL lost. And anyone who isn’t Angry has been taking Dr. Vaughn’s UFS Happy
  Pills. Let’s all check in to Chicago Hope! Dr. Adam’s
  doing free lobotomies.

  Who could blame ALAN Arkin if he DID run? Maybe he could straighten out the mess his son made. Like maybe get SOME residuals for his old movies on the Net?

  ONE THING SCOTT BARRY GOT RIGHT: SAG oughta absorb AFTRA actors, like me. I wanna pay my dues to ONE, REAL union.

  Not a fucking “Federation” of talk-show hosts,
  weather-casters, station-break announcers and jingle singers. God bless em, let THEM have the Federation. Let us have SAG!

  Comment by Angry Loser — Friday June 19, 2009 @ 9:33am PST  Reply to this post

• Michael Bell is right about Adam Arkin and Unite for Strength (first comment above).

  (My only quibble with Mike: I’m not sure what he means when he calls AFTRA “their shadow government”.)

  Adam Arkin sold out his own father by shilling for the TV/Film contract. (”I’m voting YES. With pride.”) When “The Russians Are Coming” and “Catch-22″ are exploited on the Internet, Alan Arkin won’t see a cent in residuals, because they are pre-’71 films.

  Thanks, Adam.

  Maybe your father doesn’t need those residuals to get by, but plenty of other actors do.

  While Adam deprives his father’s contemporaries of income, another comment here dismisses Mike Bell as too old to have a voice in union matters.

  He gives Bell the back of his hand, with these words: “Time to move on … You’re living in a time gone past. Let the younger generation who now have a vested interest … move the debate forward.”

  It’s not the first time we’ve seen that kind of cold-blooded Masurism from U4S and USAN. Another example, Jamey Cromwell: “We’re the 1%, David. We’re the ones who have the most to lose.”

  Ned Vaughn was asked about the morality of depriving actors of residuals for older films and television (L.A. Town Hall, 5/21).

  Ned replied, “I’m not comfortable with that.” Not comfortable? He was comfortable enough to go right on promoting that contract. Ned didn’t miss a beat.

  Cold.

  Comment by Dave Clennon — Friday June 19, 2009 @ 11:37am PST  Reply to this post

• For better or worse, DHD has become the place to run names up the flagpole for SAG president and see who salutes.

  Adam Arkin as president would most certainly pursue the same agenda as the actors who pushed through the most recent theatrical contract.

  There are a lot of great questions to pose to any actor running for the Hollywood board, the National board, or the SAG presidency. Unite for Strength and the New National Majority both promised the guild’s members that the new media provisions of the current theatrical contract will in fact sunset in 2011. We already know Alan Rosenberg’s position on this. We need to hear what U4S and NNM candidates plan to do if the AMPTP doesn’t take the sunset clause seriously.

  Comment by mheister — Sunday June 21, 2009 @ 8:09pm PST  Reply to this post

• I imagine the AFTRA pension is doing just fine, since they have almost all the new pilots this year. Thank you very much Alan R. Yes he did that. Yes he did.

  “At least we held the line” …………….. ROTFLMAO !!!!!

  Comment by #44 — Monday June 22, 2009 @ 11:23pm PST  Reply to this post

• All I have to say to my fellow actors is that you better take the next couple of years to get your ducks in a row so we CAN strike – and strike FOR REAL!
  
  
  BE READY SO YOU DON’T HAVE TO GET READY

  Comment by flixster — Tuesday June 23, 2009 @ 6:59pm PST  Reply to this post