EXCLUSIVE: Warner Bros is trying to ready its DC Comics stalwart Superman to soar again on the Big Screen, and the studio has turned to Chris Nolan to mentor development of the movie. Our insiders say that the brains behind rebooted Batman has been asked to play a "godfather" role and ensure The Man Of Steel gets off the ground after a 3 1/2-year hiatus. Nolan's leadership of the project can set it in the right direction with the critics and the fans, not to mention at the box office. Besides, Nolan is considered something of a god at Warner Bros and has a strong relationship with the studio after the success of Batman Begins and The Dark Knight. Though he wasn’t obligated to do so, he gave the studio first crack at his spec script Inception, and Warner Bros was able to buy it before other studios even got a sniff. While Nolan completes that Leonardo DiCaprio-starrer for a July 16th release, he's also hatched an idea for Warner Bros' third Batman installment. Now his brother and frequent collaborator Jonathan "Jonah" Nolan, and David Goyer who co-wrote Batman Begins and penned the story for The Dark Knight, are off scripting it. (See 'FlashForward' Showrunner Exits For Features).
Legendary Pictures will partner with Warner Bros on the next installment of Superman. Legendary also co-produced/co-financed Superman Returns in 2006. Legendary was partnered with Warner Bros as a co-producer/co-financier on the recent Batman films including Batman Begins and The Dark Knight and will be involved in Nolan’s 3rd Batman film.
Let us emphasize that Superman 3.0 is in the early stages of development. And we doubt Nolan would direct. This wouldn't be a sequel to Superman Returns but a completely fresh franchise. As one of our insiders reassures: “It would definitely not be a followup to Superman Returns." Nolan coming on board follows a hiatus period for Superman after that 2006 reboot as the studio tried to figure out whether or not to make a sequel to that version starring Brandon Routh directed by Bryan Singer. As recently as this summer, Warner Bros was still contemplating how to proceed. That's when we were told that "Bryan or Brandon are not completely out of it yet. But Warner Bros doesn't have a handle yet on it, either. [Producer] Jon Peters is trying to make something happen since he stands to benefit financially. But they [the studio] need to hear a great story that makes sense." Another insider explained to us, "We know what we don't want to do. But we don't know what we want to do. We learned a lot from the last movie, and we want to get it right this time."
Fans have long been yearning for Superman to finally get the big screen Nolan-ized treatment this classic superhero deserves.
Warner Bros clearly has learned from all five Superman movies. Superman: The Movie and Superman II starring Christopher Reeve and produced by Ilya and Alexander Salkind, were critical, fan, and financial successes. Their 1983 Superman III was mediocre. Then came a real dud in 1987, Superman IV: The Quest For Peace which continued wth Reeves but unfortunately was made by Golan-Globus's Cannon Films in association with Warner Bros. The inbetween period between that pic and 2006's Superman Returns was plagued by long delays and budget troubles and script misses. In 1997, original Batman director Tim Burton tried to make a Superman movie starring Nicolas Cage. Around 2004, J.J. Abrams wrote a film that was the first leg of a trilogy. Abrams wanted to direct, but had only directed episodes of his TV series (and wouldn't make his feature directing debut until 2006's Mission:Impossible III. McG and Brett Ratner separately were attached to that film. Ratner got closest, but Warner Bros was wary of a budget that swelled to $250 million, and which seemed risky after established star Josh Hartnett turned down the 3-picture deal that could have brought him $100 million in salary. After that, Warner Bros bosses didn't embrace Ratner's s choice of soap opera actor Matt Bomer to star.
Other prominent filmmakers were reportedly in the loop, but Warner Bros never pulled the trigger on the picture until Bryan Singer's involvement. Singer's Superman Returns was respectably reviewed for the genre. But it turned in only $52 million opening weekend, and $391 million worldwide gross. Problem was it cost too much (the budget was reportedly $270 million), and the promotion was lousy (Joel Silver was brought in at the last minute to inject macho into the marketing campaign). Worse, it left diehard fans only "meh" about a sequel starring Routh. Singer fared better, but it seems doubtful he'll be asked for an encore now. After all, Singer is now developing the spinoff X-Men: First Class for 20th Century Fox whose bosses were furious when he took on The Man Of Steel reboot instead of helming X-Men 3. But Singer and the studio subsequently made peace and he's back in the Fox fold and on board.
The restructuring of Warner Bros' business with DC Comics became Warner Bros Pictures Group president Jeff Robinov's first priority since having his contract reupped by Time Warner last summer. Problems have plagued the DC Comics-Warner Bros relationship for more than a decade. But the biggest failure has been to leave the most valuable DC Comics characters in movie development limbo by chaotically starting and stopping development on the high profile live action pics. Most recently, Warner Bros and DC Comics are finally getting their act together as evidenced by the progress on Green Lantern.
Superman 3.0 would test Warner Bros veteran executive Diane Nelson, the head of DC Entertainment Inc, that new company founded to fully realize and integrate the power and value of the DC Comics brand and characters across all media and platforms into Warner Bros Entertainment's content and distribution businesses. Nelson especially was charged with suping up Superman again because it's way too valuable to leave dormant like this. Besides, the clock is ticking.
Attorney Marc Toberoff, who keeps suing Warner Bros on behalf of creative rightsholders, warns that, in 2013, the Jerome Siegel heirs along with the estate of co-creator Joe Shuster will own the entire original copyright to Superman -- "and neither DC Comics nor Warner Bros will be able to exploit any new Superman works without a license from the Siegels and Shusters". He's also pointed out that, if Warner Bros does not start production on a new Superman sequel or reboot by 2011, the Siegels could sue to recover their damages on the grounds that the deal should have contained a clause in which the rights returned to the owners after a given time if no film was in development. The heirs of Siegel have already been awarded half the copyright for Superman. And in 2013 the heirs of co-creator Joe Shuster get the remaining half. After that, neither DC Comics nor Warner Bros will be able to use Superman without a financial agreement with the heirs. There are also stipulations on what parts of the origins story can be used in future Superman movies and which require re-negotiations with the creators' heirs or estates.
At first, Warner Bros felt no pressure to rush out another Superman pic. As Warner Bros chairman Alan Horn told a court hearing about rights to Superman, he hoped to make another Superman movie but no film was in development, no script had been written, and the earliest he foresaw another Superman film released would be 2012. He told the judge: "We had hopes to keep the character alive and to once again reinvent Superman. Our hope is to develop a Superman property and to try again. What hurt us is that the reviews and so on for the Superman movie did not get the kind of critical acclaim that Batman got, and we have other issues with Superman that concern us."
So Warner Bros is now bringing in Batman's saviour. What Nolan would do with the Superman character and story is intriguing to say the least. And he has the experience necessary of prepping and pepping a played-out franchise. The 2005 Batman Begins grossed $373 million worldwide on a reported $150 million budget. And of course 2008’s The Dark Knight crossed the $1 billion worldwide gross mark on a reported $185 million budget (and Heath Ledger posthumously won an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor).
Batman was rebooted according to Frank Miller's film noirish take on Batman. But there's a big difference between Superman's cinematic incarnations and comic book version. Warner Brothers and DC Comics for a long time weren’t sure which version they liked better. The cinematic version has been squeaky clean, occasionally campy, and has more-or-less unlimited power except when confronted with Kryptonite. The comic book version has some limits on his powers, can be darker, and fights aliens a lot more. Shortly after Dark Knight hit it big, fans assumed that Superman would be taken to the “dark” side as well. That's because Warner Bros mogul Jeff Robinov stressed post-Dark Knight that "we have to look at how to make these movies edgier". One of our insiders interpreted this to say: "He meant more sophisticated."
A more comic-accurate Superman seems like the way to go. No need to worry: Chris Nolan knows what he's doing.
Carl Icahn Now Wants ALL Of Lionsgate
routh needs some high profile romance and he is in
‘cmon dude, get with the program
jeesh!
Soooooooooo as I Read this it was that the Budget was way too high to ensure the maximum profitability that the share holders have come to realize. ASS Holes………..Did any one think 391 million dollars was a failure??????? and Routh did embodied Supes no doubt. Just back Page lex awhile and let Supes rip and Save the Day .. thats what we want Duh Death of Superman that was Crushing successful…. Good luck Ill wait and see.
it’s a complete failure because the film had to gross more the 590 million to turn a profit.
For my money if I was making a Superman movie I think I would go with Superman versus Brianiac. Can get all the out-of-space juanra stuff included along with the Fortress, the Kandorians and a bunch of weird Brianiac machines, etc. I don’t think hanging with Lois, Perry, Jimmy and Lex is going to work any more. And one more thing…please have Superman lay off the lame jokes! T
Domestic?
There is so much discussion of the new filming of a Superman movie and the director Christopher Nolan that I have a suggestion that might be worth considering. I was impressed with what the Wachowski brothers did with the Matrix franchise. Keanu Reeves (sounds like fate) made a very good “Superman” character when he did the flying and fighting scenes. I was disappointed when I saw the Superman Returns movie after having already experienced better flying sequences in the Matrix. This is my suggestion, I don’t think that Superman fans would be disappointed because “Neo” in my mind was a great Superman (I am not suggesting giving the role to Keanu, with a name like Reeves I would not like to wish him ill if the curse is true).
At any rate, this is my suggestion and I hope it gets serious consideration. We need something more than dark scenes to hide special effects, Superman is a hero of daylight not a hero of the night, he is a hero the world sees in his red and blue splendor.
lol which Wachowski sibling typed this desperate plea…after the last two Matrix movies and Speed Racer they are lucky to get jobs helming a television drama
Forget all past superman movies i would go for a trilogy where it begins with lex campaining to be elected as the next presedent of america, and with miss lane trying to find dirt on him he has her killed and evntully he becomes the next president. Superman vs the most powerfull man on the planet president luthor
There’s no way to build a “REALLY GREAT” story line around that, it a stupid idea man!
I completely agree with you! With Superman Returns being the “third installment” (pretending that the original 3 & 4 never existed) I was looking foward to seeing the Death of Superman but it looks like thes A-Holes don’t know wether or not to pull their heads out of their asses
I think Daniel hit it right on the head, something I said in 2006.
Take Smallville to the big screen, Clark has to grow up sometime.
Transfer all current characters and bring back Lex (Rosenbaum.
Why re-think a good thing…
Enough with Lex!
Lets get some new people to fight.
While I agree that Smallville should be taken to the big screen, forget Luthor. Introduce Darkseid and the New Gods. The Jerry Ordway story arc from the 1990s was some of the best, and edgiest, Superman tales of all time. It starts out with Superman forced to kill, and develops from his sense of guilt. He banishes himself from Earth, and Darkseid manipulates him until he finds himself a slave on Darkseid’s planet. The possibilities for a three picture arc are tremendous with a variation on that storyline. Get Jerry Ordway to write the story and let Nolan’s team do the screenplay.
I highly agree about the Jerry Ordway story arc. I disagree with extending Smallville, and I’m an avid Smallville watcher. They’ve already strayed way too far from the comic there to jump back in. But back to the point, they need to skip showing a “new begining” and start right off the bat with him leaving Earth because of his guilt. EXILE is, in my opinion, the best Superman story of all time.
It’s a TV show and a TV arc. They’re not going to merge that into a film, when they can have a completely different franchise going.
Star Trek did and they did pretty well for themselves. Not to mention the hundreds of other tv to movie shifts. Sex and the City, Mission Impossible, The Blues Brothers, Charlie’s Angels, Transformers, The Simpson’s movie, Borat, and on and on and on. One of the major cottage industries of Hollywood is making movies from tv shows.
Star Trek did and they did pretty well for themselves. Not to mention the hundreds of other tv to movie shifts. Sex and the City, Mission Impossible, The Blues Brothers, Charlie’s Angels, Transformers, The Simpson’s movie, Borat, and on and on and on. One of the major cottage industries of Hollywood is making movies from tv shows.
Yes but some of the favorite tv shows have been made into movies. A lot of animated shows turned to movies such as the matrix(anima) and Avatar. Also Dragonball evolution wasnt the best but it was decent. Smallville running strong could make a great movie since Tom Welling(aka ck) has been playing a strong role. Yes some may not like it, but what will it hurt to try? I do not know of much tv series that lasts more than 5-6 seasons and smallville is still running now at 9 seasons. The directors need not spend tons of money on making Superman, but could beef it up a little bit since smallville has some great action and fantasy scenes that can afford to add a little more to it with directors assist. Look at the classic Superman with Christopher Reeves(RIP) it is a classic and not much visual effects were used. Just add a little more to it for modern age and technology.
I am also tired of the Lex angle. I like the small ville idea since there is already a huge following. The other option would be the doomsday route. If the big screen movie is anything like the doomsday cartoon it should be a huge success. If they follow the cartoon movie, superman returns should come after doomsday. Everyone thought Superman was dead after he fought doomsday, then he came back to fight the evil superman that lex had created. The new superman with the black suit and the long hair.
The Doomsday cartoon was good, but nowhere near as good as the original story in the comic. It’s the greatest selling comic of all time, I would definitely follow that story line and not the one from the cartoon. they are completely different.
I think that just might work!
Unfortunately, I don’t think that will ever happen. But I will admit that I love the current season of Smallville. It’s brilliant. They’ve found a way to keep Clark’s integrity and values and yet still give him a little more of an edge. Erica Durance is the best Lois Lane ever, in my opinion. And Michael Rosenbaum turned Lex Luthor into a true psychopath. We’ll probably never seen them on the big screen. But I like the show and I do think that Welling would look incredible in the suit.
I was listening to a podcast about this recently. Every woman who plays Lois Lane in the future needs to watch Erica Durance. She’s freaking awesome. She has great screwball energy and she is sexy as hell.
I know we recently had the animated storyline but I do wonder how a big screen adapation of the Death of Superman story would play out. It could be brilliant if done correctly.
I totally agree. I haven’t faithfully followed the show Smallville, but it always made sense that they would take it to the screen when he got the suit. I was surprised it didn’t happen in 2006.
oh gods no.. smallville = soap opera for teens..
Your absolutly correct. Smallville after 9 seasons has portraded superman in all ways possible. The concept and storyline is remarkably excellent. The cast is great and the work together perfectly. Dont change a good thing, and yes it would be the logical thing to continue the saga of smallville to the big screen for a trilogy. They would make billions!!!
I have been reading superman since I was a kid in the fifties and i think smallville has pretty much bought the story upto date, I would love to see it go onto the big screen. I have been Hugely disappointed with the previous superman films even superman returns was to wishy washy for me, Lois Lane with another man and supes acting like a love sick puppy. It was utter rubbish. Carry on with smallville and let Tom turn superman into the modern hero we all want to see.
Smallville to to the big screen, great idea. Its time for Clark to become the real Superman. Big fan bace already and the cast from Smallville is great! It would be great! Clark would make a great superman. I would make billions. go with it it would work.
Want to make the next Superman movie a hit?
Two words: ROBOT SPIDERS
M
Kevin Smith ftw. Spiders are needed for Superman.
Thanagrian Snare-Beast
Hmmmm, I detect a little Dr. Venture. Yeah, Robot spiders or walking eye ball!
Love the period angle, and would go nuts to see Superman in WWII.
Captain America beat up a lot of Nazis in the books, but I suspect the currently in-development project will be set in the present day. So… jump on it!
Wrong! The vast majority of The First Avenger: Captain America is going to be set in WWII. It’s primarily going to be a period piece with later tie-ins.
How about leaning towards the popular SMALLVILLE series for an opportunity to build the SUPERMAN movie line… An already set up fan base and well liked actors… Give it a try…
….for me Smallville cannot be ignored.
rev: You should be watching Chuck, then. Routh is doing a great job as Team Chuck’s new boss.
Also, I’ve been a comics collector for 30 years — and constant Superman reader for the past 25 of them. After seeing all the tired, repeitive Christ imagery in the various talk-show previews and commercials, I couldn’t have had less interest in Superman Returns if I tried. Not because I’m for or against religious imagery either way — I simply want it done well. And the movie came off as a turgid, pretentious misfire.
So I got it for $8 on DVD at Best Buy a few months ago . . .
And yes, it was everything that the previews made it out to be — a turgid, pretentious misfire even more loaded with really, really unsubtle religious imagery. And it inexplicably being Superman 2.5, but with poor choices in the writing regarding why. (Superman being a dick and abandoning Earth to go look for Krypton when there’s not even a hint of Superman become obsessive enough to go do so in Superman 2). And Kate Bosworth playing a much better version of Smallville’s Lois Lane than Erica Durance ever has, except that Bosworth wasn’t playing Lois Lane on Smallville, she was miscast in the movie as the adult, thirtysomething-ish Lois Lane *with a five year old superson.* Can’t blame her for taking such an iconic role anyway — the fault lies with Singer for offering it to her.
The one thing the movie got right was casting Brandon Routh as Superman. He embodies Superman *and* Christopher Reeve without aping Reeve’s performance, making the character his own and acknowledging Reeve’s legacy at the same time. It’s quite a feat. I hope that he’ll be the frontrunner to play Clark in this Nolan-produced version of the franchise.
– Rob
They need to make it a little more dark like they did with Batman. Leave the Disney type movies for the cartoons.
Taking a hint from “Avatar,” how about digitizing the original TV Superman George Reeves to star as Clark Kent/Superman.
Now, THAT would be something!
They just need to make an accurate Superman movie. Not campy, but more comic like and action. Stop baseting it on the 80’s and move forward with a movie. If they dont want to spend all that money making the movie, sell it to someone who can make really good comic book movies. They will get all that money back,right? And also, I think us fans needs to write to WB and Legendary, about what and how a Superman movie can be made. I see some Superman threads on some boards and most fans have better ideas on how to make a movie. Maybe the producers need to start listening to the fans. Dont think, listen. And get a panel of fans togethere if that helps. Im telling you, a great planning with some great fans, comic book writers and studio excutives can come a great movie. How hard could this be? Make a movie based on Superman Mythology.
Yeah, because we all know how greatly Internet fan input helped Snakes on a Plane.
I agree. the Superman myth has stood the test of time without all the “improvements” Hollywood tries to throw in. His uniform is red and blue, not burgundy. Stop with the camp already. He does not have an illegitimate child. Lex is not the only villan. Stick with program…..
The Problem that has always Plagued the Superman Movies was the Villains, They always seemed Boring looking and weak, How many times can Superman fight Lex Luthor? Superman does have other enemies, And Generic Evil Aliens won’t do either, Batman’s success lies within the Arch Enemies he has, The more Interesting and Evil the Villain is the more Successful the Movie will be, Lex Luthor and General Zod Really are Boring to say the Least.
Bring on Brainiac or Bizarro!
They need to take the ending of Smallville and spin into a movie, Starring TOM WELLING, he has been doing the superman thing as long as anyone and has the look and the experience to BE THE SUPERMAN! This would be perfect for your fresh start to superman 3.0
Screw that! There’s a difference between a tv actor and a movie actor. Welling is NOT a movie actor. Anyone see The Fog remake? He sucked!
Actually, I kinda like that idea. I mean, the Smallville series has to end sometime, am I right? The whole reason I’ve never watched it, especially not in the past few years, is because they keep bringing in all these friends and enemies whom Clark never is supposed to meet UNTIL ADULTHOOD, WHILE LIVING IN METROPOLIS!!! I may not be an avid reader of comics, but I like to think I have a pretty good understanding of mythologies and timelines when it comes to a lot of the most prominent heroes in both DC and Marvel, for crying out loud; that’s the reason why that’s always bothered me!!
To anyone who happens to read this and agree with me, I thank you from the bottom of my heart.
They need to take the ending of SMALLVILLE and spin into a movie, Starring TOM WELLING, he has been doing the superman thing as long as anyone and has the look and the experience to BE THE SUPERMAN! This would be perfect for your fresh start to superman 3.0
THIS IS THE ANSWER!
SMALLVILLE!!!!!! DEEEEEER, why do people not use what is already set up for them, its been here for nine years of superman growing up. Put him in a movie, TOM WELLING, Micheal Rossumbalm is the best LEx Luthor EVER. With NOLAN on this, bring in the producers of smallville and you have yourself a Money Bag!
How about making Superman a MAN instead of supper-pussy girly-man.
Frank Miller sez in “Dark Knight” that Superman can’t…uh..
consumate his relationship with Lois…and pairs him with Wonder Woman..and a daughter – Lara is born.
Luthor may be one of Superman’s greatest enemies, but to really create the world “threat,” I would recommend having Brainiac (from Krypton) as the movie’s primary villain. Luthor could even have been tricked by Brainiac to assist in the plan, but the ultimate confrontation should be between Superman and Brainiac.
you people are all crazy the bets villain so far is zod and then lex luthor brainiac is too simple as it is, his adaptation would fail so badly, plus you got to put superman into tigths before killing him off, we still didnt see a true adaptation with real good fight scenes and eveil and special effects the american way
yu cnat killed superman before he even is in the justice elague movie their planning but i admit nolan would be the best too make an exile death of superman storryline
Superman Flies Again!
I hope he’ll fly at the box office too!
I trust Chris Nolan, but will the project happen? I think the next Batman movie should be made first, then Nolan should respectfully give us a brand new Superman film from the origin etc and a couple of sequels will be nice too~!
Ok, People tend to focus way too much on the origin story of Superman….JUST STOP!!! A good story would be The Death of Superman. Here is what should happen as far as Superman is concerned. Brandon Routh can come back and play Superman but he will be killed by Doomsday! A new Superman (DEAN CAIN) comes back from the dead! Whatever story is decided, the studios need to stop trying to find someone to replace Chris Reeves. Dean Cain is an excellent choice for playing Clark Kent/Superman. He’s familiar with the character (He is a huge Superman fan himself) He could bring a much needed edge to Superman, if they decide to have a darker feel for it now that Chris Nolan is on board. People don’t want to see some nobody as a character that they are familiar with….SO GIVE US AN ACTOR WHO EMBODIES WHAT SUPERMAN IS ALL ABOUT…SIGN DEAN CAIN TO PLAY SUPERMAN IN THE REBOOT!!! For all the haters that may find shock value in this..I guarantee that if Dean comes back for this movie, this Superman movie will gross double of what Superman Returns did. As long as you have a solid script, a fantastic story, and a Superman/Clark Kent that everybody can identify with…that my friends will bring in one of the best Superman movies ever. if you find it hard to guarantee..just look at what Chris Nolan has done for the Batman franchise. Bring back Dean Cain as Superman and the Superman franchise will be back better than ever. Dean Cain and Chris Nolan equals awesome Superman movie!
It’s a real shame about the Tim Burton / Nick Cage version. The way I heard, it was envisioned as a complete revamping with Clark as a slightly awkward geek who feels completely alone and out of place in this ‘alien world’ – the way Tarantino referred to him in Kill Bill Vol. 2:
“Superman didn’t become Superman. Superman was born Superman. When Superman wakes up in the morning, he’s Superman. His alter ego is Clark Kent. His outfit with the big red “S”, that’s the blanket he was wrapped in as a baby when the Kents found him. Those are his clothes. What Kent wears – the glasses, the business suit – that’s the costume. That’s the costume Superman wears to blend in with us. Clark Kent is how Superman views us. And what are the characteristics of Clark Kent. He’s weak… he’s unsure of himself… he’s a coward. Clark Kent is Superman’s critique on the whole human race.”
I think Burton and Cage would’ve been perfect for this vision! Sure, it might’ve ticked off hard core fans, but the timing – smack dab in the middle of Supe’s twenty year hiatus – would’ve given plenty of time for the newer reboots.
If Nolan is involved perhaps he could find a way to work Superman into the world he has created for Batman. I would love to see a Superman Batman film. Afetr the 3rd Batman and the re-introduction of we could get a really high quality cross-over film where these characters interact with one another. Thats what I would LOVE to see.
I have been a superman fan all of my life…..Ant to even think he would dissapear makes no sense…How can you think of killing off the character three words Geoff Johns Brandon routh Chris Nolan
While I’m not critical of making a “darker” Superman movie, I don’t think its wise for the studio to hope that would automatically make a better film. You can tell a sophisticated, even edgy, story without going all out to seem dark. I really was worried about this, but not now that Nolan will be acting as “godfather” to a forthcoming film. I trust his sensebilities. Story-wise, why not Grant Morrison’s All Star Superman? A little less comic-centric aspects, a more concise plot, and I think it would translate great for the silver screen.
i hope they bring Brandon Routh back as Superman i think he deserves another shot at it but more importantly i hope Superman gets back on
track it’s been to long already and they should start working on a new movie wish them luck
it’s staring everyone in he face screaming to be the next superman movie. we need peter jackson who is desperate to do sci-fi comic, to direct the death of superman, world without superman, and the return of superman back to back with an unknown cast
Anything else will be a complete waste of time, ad do a complete disservice to the man of steel. Please no more rubbish lex luthor movies, bring on war world
Okay! Now I have seen all of the Superman Movies, the justice League, and all animated series of Superman and I know what I like and I know what the people will like. ACTION!!! Superman needs to battle not one but two, maybe even three enemies. Enemies such as Doom (Looking like the werewolf from Van Helsing when he is fighting Dracula), Braineack (Looking something like the Ironman) and Darkside (Looking something like Ben Grimm “the Thing” from the Fantastic Four, but he needs to be black a little more realistic and meaner.) and in the beginning ACTION!!! Fighting, from beginning to end, show truly how powerful Superman really is. If no one knows Watch the last episode of the Justice League where Superman fights Braineack/Darkside. Or watch Superman VS. Doom… I have an immaculate script/storyline…
i agree. if you dont have routh in this, then im boicotting it. you HAVE to build on what has been made. RETURNS was great, but we are all vulnerable and it takes time to warm to someone we thought wed lost. Singer had a lot of guts to bring the character back, and he did so with some grace and sensitivity, that enabled us neysayers to brew with this new fellow brandon, and to reconnect with a lost love, and hero we believe(ed) in and who lives in us all. Sure the film could have been better, but so can anything. It had been over 2 decades since the last time, and so we are not about to just act like everythings normal again. we were frosty and unsure like Lois was. It was made and we have to be responseable and carry on from this point! Just carry on from this starting point, and make us look in wonder. The it will be great, and we may believe again. The world needs superman. And we need it to carry on from where RETURNs left it.
what, are people really still scratching their heads wondering how a bastard son-fathering, cheesy Christ figure, gay metrosexual version of Superman fared worse than expected? keep Singer as far away from this property as you can
Superman more than most of these comic book characters is easy to screw up, because he’s become a stand-in for “the American way” and a particular period in American history…stray too far from that and the character’s appeal falls apart…the original movie nailed it, from the Kansas boyhood (sans tasteless Cheerios product placement) to Clark Kent’s debut on the streets of Metropolis…really the character needs to stay close to his 30s-40s roots, a period piece wouldn’t be out of the question
at least the franchise is out of the danger zone where Tim Burton was going to have a balding Italian fight a giant spider in some kind of tribute to old B movies
Right on brother. A period piece is the way to go. A big part of the story of Superman is the fear of the rise of Fascism in Europe.
Agreed, keep Singer out of it. Hopefully, Nolan will research and realize the best live-action presentation of the Superman character was that of actor GEORGE (not Chris) Reeves. If that chemistry could be captured in a modern setting, go for it. If not, do it as a period piece. Has anyone talked to Billy Zane about the project? He can project George’s charm with the right balance of tongue0in0cheek and respect for the material as he did in the Phantom.
I like the idea of Billy Zane as Superman. He does have a way about him that I think would work
While I agree that the filmmakers need to stay true to his roots, the nostalgia for a period piece is the kind of thing that holds Superman back. In comics, animated TV shows and movies, Superman has been modernized. He’s sci-fi. He’s always been sci-fi, but in comics, like Batman, he has evolved. Instead of relying on nostalgia, Superman needs to be updated. Nolan position now is not something you normally hear (”mentoring” a blockbuster franchise) and he has made comments previously about having an aversion to superheroes with superpowers. He does however, also have an aversion to camp, while creating a strong dramatic structure. This may be great for Superman. But his involvement is unique, and just how involved he gets remains to be seen.
Dude, thank you. People keep scratching their heads when I mention that a huge turnoff for me in that movie was the Jesus/God-is-Superman symbolism in the movie. FINALLY someone else saw it.
Superman has always been a Christ figure. Read the “Gospel According to the World’s Greatest Superhero.”
Thanks for injecting your homophobia into the discussion.
Actually, you just injected “homophobia” into the discussion…
No sir you are wrong,
The homo erotic tones in Superman Returns are all Bryan Singer’s doing. Superman was portrayed like a datable Jesus in that movie. And whats up with all the Superbaby mama drama. Nobody wants to see that shit except people who are in love with the man of steel.
Keep Singer away from that production. Its Superman not Supergod
I Trust Chris Nolan and You Should Too.
It’s not homophobic. It’s a taste of the traditional aspect that makes Superman, SuperMAN. No one wants to see and sensitive super hero. True fans of Super what that “takes no sh_t” attitude that made him who he is. So get off your PC high horse, your smelling up this page.
Take that homophobic kryptonite and stick it where you would most enjoy it.
A period piece….that’s intriguing. but it’ll never happen, because it would eliminate any chance WB could have for an eventual “Justice League” movie, like Marvel Studios is trying to do with the Avengers.
A period piece – brilliant idea. How about late 30s? Could lead into a WWII-themed sequel, then Cold War, etc.
Sounds good, but let’s not as far as the Cold War. I wouldn’t
want to see any more debacles like the last Indiana Jones film.
a period piece… yeah like sky captain and the world of tomorrow? we all know how well THAT did
“at least the franchise is out of the danger zone where Tim Burton was going to have a balding Italian fight a giant spider in some kind of tribute to old B movies”
Johnny Depp woulda been recast in the role anyways…
And he didn’t want Superman to have a cape.
I think a period piece would be a GREAT idea. They can do that 1950’s anti-red communism is evil, saving the world form fascism and despotism thing, with all the flag-waving, tea-party patriotism. Would be huge and would go a long way to helping restore Hollywood’s image as not being anti-American. That version might not play so well overseas of course so in the alternative they can always just make Superman fighting the Nazis. Either way a period piece is a cool idea.
I’m not so sure about a period piece not selling well overseas. I feel that many people in the corroding European societies would enjoy a little breath of fresh air that just such a story line would produce. It is getting to look more and more like a film clip from ‘1984′ in far too many places now and a little reminder of how it could be if a champion of the people (not the illuminati) actually existed.
Just a thought.
What is wrong with you people????? A period piece would totally ruin the franchise and send it in a completely wrong direction! The rights to this all powerful hero will be reverted back to the original creator’s families, and if you start something that old fashioned on a character that has almost unlimited possibilities, what happens in 3 years when they want to do a sequel and the owners hated the idea to begin with? (it really is stupid, remember that movie about the cold war called 13 days or whatever?) The best way to go with this franchise is to not do a reboot and start from the beginning, but do a new movie about a villain that IS NOT LEX LUTHOR. For pete’s sake you can only do so many stories about him as the lead bad guy and it gets stale fast. Kevin Spacey’s take on him was an excellent breath of fresh air to an already stale 4 movies previous bad guy. Why not do a villain that can actually HURT Superman? With something other then Kryptonite too, that got old fast. How about a movie with Darkseid and Apokolips? Scott Free could even be in it. They could do that storyline that was the finale for the animated series where Darkseid controls Superman. Or they could bring the death of Superman to the big screen. Doomsday would be a kick ass villain to see on the big screen. Any thoughts?
Doomsday would be a slick villain if done right. That arc and the resulting arcs in the days of the comic were EPIC to me. Parasite could be a dangerous adversary as well like the arc where Superman was overloading with power and parasite took it ALL. But yeah, the doomsday animated film was nostalgic an I loved seeing a villain that could stand toe-to-toe with Superman physically, but it could be done better and quite possibly should be.
Ditch Singer – his squeeky clean productions never deliver what the true fans want…suspense, depth and vilains with teeth. This is what Nolan deliver’s. His involvement is the best news in 2 years!
‘Yes’ to Doomsday and steering away from Lex as the only baddie. Just imagine Nolan lining this up for a meeting with Batman and the Justice league in future – awesome.
Finally no more rubbish please about smalleville hitting the big screen, it’s got too much history to it and Welling, though good at what he does, is no large screen superman.
Whatever Nolan does I’m sure it’ll be great. Just one thing please Mr Nolan… ditch Kate Bosworth as Lois… that casting could not have been more off the mark then hiring paris hilton as lois!
Agreed. Period piece could be a whole lot of fun. Screw the “update the character for today” crap.
The problem with Superman is two fold. For starters, it is hard to create any drama or tension in the script as Superman is essentially a God, and is limited in very few ways. Secondly, Superman is an inherently patriotic figure. This creates a problem as the people who work in and run Hollywood have very hard time with a protagonist being associated with patriotism. America is essentially a bad place, and the only people who are patriots are inbred, tea bagging flag waivers who cling to their guns and religion. The way most mainstream movies approach these issues is at odds with one of the core dynamics of Superman. A period piece would be very interesting, but the problem would still exist. Seriously, in the last Superman movie they could not even bring themselves to let …”and the American Way” stay in the script. It had to be replaced with “and all the other stuff”.
Dude Superman Returns was in the spirit of the first two Superman films. Routh, a relatively unknown came out and did great, with what he was given. The only thing I held against the movie was giving him a kid and their choice for louis lane. But then again i didn’t like Margot Kidder as Louis Lane either.
I think you mean Lois Lane, don’t you? Be careful or people really will think that Superman got off track if he has a kid with Louis Lane!
Louis Lane? Who is he? I don’t remember him.
Here Here! I Agree, bad casting on both films.
What about the Adventures of Superman on TV? I thought the Lois character was great casting, even the editor of the daily planet, but Superman? Nah, don’t think so! Dean Cain ain’t Supes!
The reason Singer did the metro Superman, was because everyone was crying over making the new Superman a clone of Christopher Reeves. They hired an actor who mimicked Reeves pretty decently, and made the movie era based. I wouldn’t blame Singer for that, he’s a great director. (It would have been great though if Cyclops had thrown down with Supe)
But I do agree that they need to steer away from the panni-waste sponge bob feel good anti-violence Superman. We need a slightly more brash, and violent action hero. Not a girlscout in blue tights.
Anti-violent superhero makes no sense. They should be throwing down in awesome spectacles, and since Superman has the biggest power range, his action should be the most spectacular of all.
Mediocre?The first two superman movies are considerd classics and did very well, the original superman was the batman begins of it’s time.
There was just two bad sequals.
Absolutely agree. The first two movies benefited from the wit of the script that the last two lacked; they instead opted for straight camp and failed miserably.
Seriously, the first two Superman movies set the standard for the genre.
I agree! “MEDIOCRE!” Without Superman: The Movie OR Superman 2 — there WOULD BE NO SUPER-HERO MOVIES. They paved the way and are still classics of the genre — and were filmed back-to-back. The MAJOR problem was that Warners decided to make #3 a Richard Pryor comedy and then Superman 4 was a GOLAN-GLOBUS mess that really had nothing to do with the first two films.
I’ve actually read most of the subsequence SUPERMAN incarnations — each had its merits, but was lacking the humanity. As long as they come up with a really amazing and exciting story with good ol’ action, adventure, romance, humor and heart then it’ll be a winner…
Up, up and AWAY!
Hopefully in the next Superman, Lex Luthor won’t try to kill Supes with Kryptonite real estate
Hi Randall–
Thanks for setting the record straight! How quickly people forget what enormous hits the first two Superman movies were (and embraced by the critics as well). The third installment would have been great had it not turned into “The Richard Pryor Show” halfway thru (at least, it got rid of Margot Kidder’s neurotic, unappealing Lois Lane). “Superman IV” remains problematic. Low-grade Cannon Films took over the rights, and cut the original 2 1/2 print down to 89 minutes for the theatrical release. It wasn’t screened for the critics (who therefore hated it) but it certainly wasn’t as horrible as the reviews were. Still, I see no need for any attempt to “re-boot” the series. It certainly wasn’t Brandon Routh’s fault that Christopher Reeve remains the definitive Superman!
I agree, the first two Superman movies are awesome! No way are they mediocre. First one is a little slow for a while, but the second one is all action.
“Thanks for setting the record straight! How quickly people forget what enormous hits the first two Superman movies were (and embraced by the critics as well).”
Do you realize the fan-boys out there weren’t even born when the first two movies were made? All the things people are saying here are true and at the same time false. We will never get Superman right if the producers keep paying homage to dead actors and washed up latino Supermen. But I tell you what…as long as they keep Brian Singer and Brandon Routh away from the franchise anything else will be great.
I agree, I have been a fan since childhood and couldn’t wait to see the first big screen version of Superman, (Christoper Reeve). With all the latest effects available to cinema makers of the time, they did a good job, as they did in S2, probably moreso. A little dated looking now, but good in it’s day. Needs a serious update. Maybe take a leaf from Spiderman? Liked all those films. Maybe it’s the love story going on there? It never seemd to work in any Superman films.
Justice league, bring it on. Films for me have to have a story though, not just wham Bam! Needs to be nurtured, done with care, to have any lasting effect. Maybe the money people will just give it up as a bad job. Fantastic Four is good example of how to screw up a good franchise, just make it wham bam rubbish. STORY! Please. Wham bam shoot em up is great, we need that in films like these, but the story is So important too.
Maybe she was factoring in 3, which was HORRIBLE.
3 was lightweight and silly — but at least it was better than 4…actually I’d even watch 3 over SUPERMAN RETURNS come to think of it. (People forget 3 was also one of the highest grossing films of 1983 — it wasn’t a bomb. 4 was).
Make it a period piece. Set it in the 50s. Have Supes fighting giant robots. Count giant pile of money.
Yes/\ That Sky captain Jude law movie– on visual appeal it was a grand slam, just lacked everything else. That kind of look and feel in a Superman movie could even envoke the feel of the old fleisher cartoons.
The most powerful superhero of all time should not be fighting weak humans(lex). Where is Brainiac? Where is Bizarro? How about a cameo from Batman, Martian Manhunter, or Wonderwoman so we can get on to the Justice League.
My comment disappeared? There was no bad language in it. Site must be updating.
BEST NEWS I’VE HEARD ALL MONTH!
This is a fantastic (maybe gutsy because he’s juggling so much?) move by Warner Bros to help pull their superhero franchises out of the dust. Hopefully Nolan will, as you’ve mentioned, help strike a balance between the “And Justice for All” campiness and the comic-book inspired darker subject matters.
The real thing to note here is SYNERGY. Most fanboys have always cursed Warner Bros. for their lack of continuity in the DC Comics universe, whereas Marvel has laid the groundwork for a full re-teaming of all their self-owned properties together with “The Avengers”. So, now that Nolan is writing “Batman 3″ while plotting the new “Superman”, does this mean that the big screen might finally see a “Batman vs. Superman” movie, a la the 1980s Frank Miller graphic novel The Dark Knight Returns. Only time will tell…
Fans haven’t always complained about the lack of continuity between DC movie franchises. Mainly, because there have only been 4 of note(Batman Burton Era, Superman “Donner” Era, Batman Begins/TDK and Superman Returns) and nobody wants to tie Steel or Catwoman to anything that isn’t burning. No, the fans only ever wanted crosscontinuity when Marvel announced they where doing it, WAY after WB announced Justice League which at that point had little ties to other films.
What fans HAVE always complained about is that WB can;t get anything that isn’t Batman or Superman on films. Oh, they’ve started plenty of them, Wonder WOman, Teen Titans, SUperMax(Green Arrow), Suicide Squad, Aquaman. But they never organized well enought to do them.
Yeah, I wouldn’t call all four Superman movies lame. The first one was the best comic book movie of all time until Spiderman came around. The second one was pretty good, too. However, Superman Returns was awful on so many levels I can’t believe anyone went to see it…
Right you are rexbatt…
I am a diehard Superman fan and I did not even buy the Superman Returns DVD even on black Friday. I got a boot leg copy of it and I purposely did not write the title of the movie on it.
HUH?? Superman 1 and 2 are now “mediocre?” They are both considered as two of THE greatest superhero films ever made and blow away every Batman film, including the overrated slop “The Dark Knight.”
Mediocre?? I bet of they were full of CGI-cartoon animation which will NEVER look anything remotely close to realistic, the writer would think those two movies were the best.
He said III was mediocre, not I and II. He called I and II “critical, fan and box office successes”.
Thats not what he said about Supes 1+2! However, though you may personally love them, they dont blow away Batman begins or Dark Knight. Supes 1+most of 2 were filmed together. Supes 1 was great right up until the missiles were launched then it went downhill. Amazingly, they were filming a movie but never wrote an ending. The horrible backwards Earth time reversal cop out wax 2’s ending and they used it. Then 2 had the as bad Superkiss saves the day ending. Supes 1 stopped being the best superhero movie when Spider-Man came out. Now its behind 2 Batman movies, 2 Spider-Man movies,and Iron Man. 1 is still great, but not from start to finish with the horrible end. 2 is more in the area of Fantastic Four and the Hulk.
The first two Christopher Reeves Superman movies were FABULOUS!!!! Who are you to call them mediocre? Even the last 2, while full of big problems, weren’t anywhere near as awful as that 2006 thing. Reeves just WAS Superman – hard to imagine a better one (sorry all you Lois & Clark fans).
Truth, Justice and the AMERICAN WAY.
Or we could go the Euro-Atheist Global Socialist Way.
Or Islamic Way.
Or Russian China Atheist Dictatorship Communist Way.
Or back to the Pagan Human Sacrifice Jungle Way.
Yep, that’s about all the choices I think. Take out American, and fill it in with one of the others. Take your pick.
That was funny and scary true.
I wish they’d hurry these productions on up!
I think that the 1978 Superman scored because, (a.) it was charming and well-cast, (b.) it came out at a time when special effect films were poorly done and/or very scarce, and (c.) it – like the 1980 US Men’s Olympic Hockey Team – gave a country filled with frustration and self-loathing a vehicle to say, “We don’t suck, so ef off!”
Casting is always key – and sfx has come a long way, so we’re not easily awed nowadays – but perhaps the time has come to make the US Govt. and all the scumbag politicians the “bad guys (and gals)”. How about Superman growing up buying the “American Dream” – only to mature and see that the Dream doesn’t match reality and have him go off on the Political Elite and bring that Dream closer to reality.
Now THAT would strike a super hero chord with the rest of us unwashed masses.
Hollywood has run out of original ideas. I thought the glut of remakes were bad enough…. Now we have “reboots” which are REMAKES of remakes!
Seriously, how many times can one retell the story of Superman?
Rules for the next Superman movie:
1) Superman Returns never happened.
2) Superman is not 20 years old. Sure, he used to be, but that part of his story’s been told to death. Most people today envision Supes as something of a father figure, so he should be at least 40. Go read Kingdom Come.
3) Superman is not emo. He can be morally conflicted (and that’s the perfect story angle, really — fighting the good fight in a world of moral relativism) but he’s a man about it. He does not mope, and he does not spy on women with his x-ray vision.
4) Lois is also not a child. A 20-year old with a Pulitzer just makes people roll their eyes. If you need a 20-year old character, that’s what Jimmy Olsen is for.
5) No super-children. Ever. Damn you, Singer.
6) No origin story, please. We all know who Superman is.
7) If you must use Lex Luthor (and please try not to), make him a credible threat, not a bad joke a la Hackman and Spacey. Luthor should genuinely believe that Superman’s existence poses a threat to the future of humanity, or at least use that as a rationalization for his hatred.
Agreed with every thing you said!!!!
Superman is an alien. He could be 100 years old and still look 20.
DEAD ON. You have the best comment on this page,u had me at “KINGDOM COME”
ditto Randall.
also leave Singer out. bring in Abrams who did an excellent job on Star Trek. Introduce a Brianiac, Lex Luthor partnership and sequel into Darksied. That way each movie has the potential of great special effects, contrasting characters and a climatic end.
YES!
This is the best news I’ve read in a long time. Congratulations Warner Brothers, you finally got a clue. Now let Nolan do his work and don’t screw it up!
A completely new take on Superman would do very well, meaning that it must be done as close to the original comic as possible – even shot in the proper time period.
Anything and everything else has already been tried in all of the Superman movies and they just havent cut it, so what’s left?
If Nolan wants to give the “Dark Knight” treatment to Superman, I wish him luck. Christopher Reeve was excellent, but he was the only excellent thing about the early movies; and “Superman Returns” was unspeakably bad: Brandon Routh couldn’t act his way out of a paper bag, and even the great Kevin Spacey was forced to camp it up, instead of being a genuine villain. We will not speak of Lois Lane.
Perhaps Nolan will realize what the earlier movies have never gotten: Superman is not a human being. Despite his “socialization” in Smallville, he is different from the humans with whom he interacts, and it’s not just because of his powers. Nolan nailed Batman’s psychological imbalances; can he convincingly conceptualize an alien?
If anyone can get it right, it’s probably Nolan, but I’m not sure anyone can get it right. It irritates and baffles me that television’s “Smallville” has come closer to “getting” the character than any of the movies.
If a new Superman movie is to have a human villain, be it Lex Luthor or someone else, I hope desperately that they won’t make him a humorous figure with a bimbo girlfriend. Heath Ledger is dead, but might I suggest John Malkovich?
http://www.metacritic.com/film/highscores.shtml
2nd best reviewed movie of all time! Not mediocre
Based on only 7 critic reviews.
Skew much?
This could be a good thing for the series. I’m especially happy to hear Brandon Routh is still in the mix. Bringing him back would be the right movie.
@ Randall
Absolutely agree. What is Nikki talking about? The first two movies in the 1978 series are PHENOMENAL movies that represented everything Superman was for an entire generation (my generation) of movie goers.
Those movies are part of the reason Terrence Stamp has a career today.
“Kneel before Zod.”
Come on. Those movies were great. Routh was miscast and Singer was full of himself. Spacey was bad in SR too.
Good luck to Nolan.
Right after The Dark Knight I felt that the only way to top the film was to introduce Superman. Gotham calls on Superman to rid the city of The Dark Knight. Ultimately Superman would figure out that Batman is actually Gotham’s Knight in shining armor, but there are a lot of things Nolan could do with this idea. It would also set up a Superman franchise.
Agree with Randal.
The original superman was great for its time. It was like 3 movies in one.
The 1st sequel wasn’t bad either. It just kinda dropped off from there.
If they reboot superman, go comic booky. forget lex luther, he is not a villan that superman is scared of. Darkseid is the only guy that fans would wonder if superman would live or die, and know for sure he would get beat up to hell…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y89aBjcgDd8
or re-work his powers, so he is like solar powered and needs sun, so weakens without it and has to win without them, but that changes him too much.
or apocalypse…hmm..looks like the guy from the increadible hulk tho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfiFHzuvFjY&feature=related
Actually, that’s Doomsday,not Apocalypse. Apocalypse is a Marvel Comics character. Superman and Doomsday, DC.
That being said, Superman vs. Darkseid or Brainiac or even General Zod again, would be cool. I just don’t want to have to sit through another Lex Luthor. Superman has such an awesome Rogues Gallery… I have no idea why it is left untapped.
And finally, don’t get rid of Brandon Routh. It wasn’t his fault that Bryan Singer mutilated and defaced the Superman character and mythos. I think Routh did a pretty good job with what he had to work with.
That is actually Doomsday, Apocalypse is a Marvel Villain Superman is DC
I agree with the need to re-work his powers somewhat, and like Darkseid as a villain since he can go toe-to-toe with Superman physically, as opposed to Lex Luthor who cannot (and only ever stands a chance because he outsmarts Superman, which seems like an odd message to send—kids, be stupid but physically strong!).
I’ve always thought Superman has 3 main problems:
1. Not human, so he’s difficult to identify with
2. His near-invulnerability makes it even tougher, as well as making his fights seem anti-climatic
3. The red cape, which makes him seem cartoony.
So for #2, stronger villain and power limits, for #3 make the cape darker and not absurdly huge (and give a function, perhaps—healing, protection, something). Not sure what you do about #1.
I think your solar-powered idea is interesting, but agree that it probably wouldn’t work. It makes a sort of sense, but it also seems a bit silly. With the cape, I was thinking about having it be the blanket he came to Earth in, but then he’s a grown man who’s carrying around his blankey from childhood, which is even sillier than him sharing a power source with modern houses.
Youre very right! Supes is hard to identify with because of being an alien. His powers are so great, it does hurt the character but heres why: LACK OF DRAMA! When you have a character fighting a downhill battle you have a problem. Look @ Dark Knight though, Nolan created a building drama that got worse and worse for Batman. James Cameron does this in all his movies too. The more intense the drama, the more we love it. Of course you have to have great stories, actors, music, directing,etc., but Nolan is actually smarter than the audience, like Cameron. Dont be so sure he’ll stick to the comics and DC may have said “We need a whole new mythology” because of the court battle and they may want distance from those suing them.
I bought the Superman Returns Blu-Ray because I am a long-time fan of Superman, but it was disappointing. Really disappointing. I had expected the treatment that I think, they are talking about doing now. There’s a lot of material for it in the graphic novels.
What we need to see is that “torment” of Superman that happens in the comics but never on screen. I want to see him as a kid get the s**t kicked out of him by bullies… not getting hurt, but having to endure years of humiliation and shame to protect his secret. I want to see the adult Clark Kent retain the psychological bruises, and have the decision making of Superman impacted by this past.
Best of all [if you want this new Supe to sell well] I REALLY want to see the sequence from the Dark Knight series where Superman goes to Gotham to take down Batman because he’s a vigilante, but in watching him decides he can redeem Batman, becoming both friend and psychologist to him. (make sure it’s Christian Bale. Best Batman ever.)
I agree that a Superman/Batman crossover would be cool, but there is NO way it would ever happen. Superman just doesn’t fit into the world that Nolan has created for Batman. It would ruin the Batman movies.
Superman needs tougher villians that can stand toe to toe with him. Throw in Superman learning some good fighting moves (flying with his fist out is kind of lame) and you have a good movie. Get creative with his powers as well, you can do more with heat vision than shoot somebody.
The ideas behind Superman Returns were good ones. Making it a sequel to the original was smart. The script, however, was not good. Routh was well cast. Bosworth was not. Supes needs a really strong Lois Lane. And how can you have Superman save the world and still have 20 minutes left? Hello, Superman saves the world and then flies off and waves at the camera. Not twenty minutes of will he live or die. Bleh.
Totally agree with this!!
I think the script has got be right – so just give it to Geoff Johns. let someone who has the runs on the board for scriptwriting help him out with dialogue, run it past Nolan if you have to.
But think the best way to look at the Superman Franchise is, Superman 1 and 2 are Chapter one
Superman Returns is Chapter two
Superman 3.0 will be Chapter three
That way they don’t have to waste time retelling the perfectly good Dick Donner origin story, but can go in a new direction
Not a big Superman guy, myself. I would like to see Batman kick his ass around the Batcave, tho.
I don’t have a take on who could play Superman…but Emily Blunt would OWN Lois Lane.
I was never an avid Superman reader, but I was a big fan and I thoroughly enjoyed the Death of Superman series. To see Superman at his lowest, most human point was thrilling. To see him lose was mind bending. The reviews as I remember them were positive because the story was strong. I can’t remember what happened afterwards, I think there was a Superman in heaven story or something fairly weak before he made his less than stellar return. But the Death of Superman illustrated a world without the man of steel, and it was a beautiful and sad story, full of stories of other hero’s struggles to cope without their figurehead.
Making a movie of the Death of Superman would sell. If it was done right. Which means he’s gritty, more of an everyman – strong but not unstoppable. We need to have our notions of him flipped around so that when he begins to lose, our hopes are broken and our hearts are sad. He’s the all sacrificing hero, after all. And Lois Lane needs to be worth loving, so that when they lose each other we feel our own lost loves. I’d see it as a time lapsed story, full of scenes of Doomsday but also cutting back to tell other stories from Superman’s life.
This comment is too long, but I think this is the story to tell and wanted to illustrate why.
I love this idea, but I think they need to do another movie first before the death and rebirth of Superman arc…
I think a Brainiac villain based movie, with plot seeds planted for Doomsday who could be created by Luthor with Brainiac’s technology.
Then maybe a JLA film where they allude to something coming for Superman. After the credits we get a shot of the inside of a cell door, as the seconds tick by the tension builds and then BAM! Doomsday’s fist wrapped in bandages punches the door just like in comics.
This would lead into the Death of Superman arc.
That’s the way I think it should go anyway.
It’ll be more like Superman III, unless WB moves beyond the reliance on Kryptonite to weaknen superman. There has to be some equally powerful external force to challenge Superman. That’s why the Doomsday storyline worked; that’s why the SM II storyline worked.
Donner/Lester Superman I & II are miracles of tone and execution.
3 & 4 are quite problematic, but the first two paved the way for ALL superhero movies to come. Before those late 70s Supes flicks, the cloest thing to a superhero movie was a big screen ep of the 60s camp Batman series.
Without Superman I & II there is no Dark Knight. No Iron Man. No X-Men. None of it.
or just rip off the superman vs doomsday stoyrline. cuz its good.
from evildeaddrew on youtube;
Here’s a novel idea instead of making the lousy Superman returns make a superman trilogy starting with “The death of superman”, then “Reign of the supermen”, finally “The return of superman” This way people can see superman like they want and an awesome cgi doomsday.
The first two Superman movies were ok in their time but viewing them today they seem lame and dated. Superman needs a makeover that takes him him back to his roots. I agree with the idea of a period piece that takes the character back to the 30’s or 40’s. Lastly we don’t need a “campy” Superman with lame inside jokes or unwarrented humor. We need a serious Superman with all his powers and personality intact. The new creators should read old Man of Steel Superman comics not the new updated “Man of Metro-sexual” version. Put some toughness back into Superman.
I enjoyed the campy Superman movies just like I enjoyed the campy Batman movies. But Batman Begins, Xmen, Hulk, Ironman have shown the way to make these movies and Superman needs to get in line. Superman Returns was close, but Clark Kent is not a loser in the comic books, and Lex Luthor is a brilliant industrialist. Time to restart at chapter 1.
I agree about the first two Supes movies. Straight downhill from there on out. Superman Returns was, in my mind, downright silly — a case of adding false, soap-opera complications to somehow make the franchise more interesting? Guess what — you just need a good director and writer to accomplish that, even with what you’ve been given.
Plenty of good creatives have worked on the comic titles over the years and kept the character, supporting cast and milieu interesting. He’s not exactly the “big boy scout” Chris Reeve played…I think there’s room for a noble, heroic character who is trying to work out his place in the world, and cares about people and the world without being preachy or moralizing. And can still have a sense of humor. You know — an old-fashioned Hollywood hero. Remember those?
I agree regarding first two Christopher Reeve films. I’m not a film critic. I went to Superman Returns to be entertained and took my young son to see a hero he could look up to. Not mentally tormented Batman.
I felt Superman Returns delivered in spades. It was entertaining. I loved that actors from the old tv series were used. I thought Kevin Spacey was awesome. My son had a hero that wasn’t perfect but was a role model. Why does everything have to become dark and edgy. We have real life for that!! Ha ha.
Totally Agree with this dude.
I had a similar experience with taking my step son to see SR and thought it was good. not perfect, but there was definately plenty to build on…
Superman is about not about darkness, Superman is about HOPE
Yet more evidence that there isn’t a creative mind left in hollywood. The far left group think has sucked all the intellect and creativity smooth out of hollywood. It’s been obvious by the relative lack of success for the last 8-10 years of many films – very few true hits.
hollywood continues to marginlize themselves and isolate themselves more and more from the American people, whom they look down upon as too ‘ignorant’ or not ‘enlightened’ enough – you’ll have to forgive us if the intellectual musings of someone who pretends to be something they aren’t for a living doesn’t exactly sway, We, the people!
Can someone translate this screed please?
“far left group think”
Go back to Austria, Adolph.
What Nolan figured out for the Batman franchise, and what he will probably do for the Superman franchise is the development of the alter ego. The first two Batman’s, and Nolan’s Batman Returns, and The Dark Knight, and the first two Superman movies were so successful because the movies devote a respectable amount of time to the characters of Bruce Wayne and Clark Kent respectivly. Thats the big that that Superman Returns lacked, they just treated Clark Kent like a prop or a stand-in instead of the independent character you have to make him. If they examine the success of Smallville they will understand that better too, and I personally believe they could translate that mythology on to the big screen.
That is an insightful comment. Superman is as much human Clark Kent as alien demi-god. Part of the reason he’s been around for 70 years is because people are genuinely interested in Clark. He’s the classic hero of 40’s, 50’s and early 60’s film, the kind Hollywood doesn’t know how to make anymore. Clark is a good, decent guy, but tough and morally certain. He is a real old fashioned hero. Clark can be a breath of fresh air in this time of ironic Iron Man and dark Batman. People love the moral ambiguity and gray zones of the new superhero movies, but the films are all blending together. Superman has the curse and blessing of being able to really stand out in sharp contrast. As you say, Smallville gets to touch on this. Clark is at his best when being contrasted with the darker heroes that come on the show. It highlights the different approach between Superman and most modern heroes. His character will really shine if they ever get around to a Justice League movie.
Hey Oracle. This is an excellent observation. You are right.
And this is why if Nolan is involved… and by involved I mean really overseeing the new Superman film from start to finish… it will be great. People tend to forget that Nolan has made a lot of great films, not just the Batman films. He has made Insomnia, Memento, The Prestige, and that Inception film which looks wicked. Not a single bad movie so far.
Please, not another origin story. We already know Superman’s origin. Give us action. Don’t bore us with the details.
I think the concept of superman is captured in his name “Super” “Man” and that entails not only super powers but also super virtues, super character, and super personality. To pull that off you absolutely need character development. Brandon Routh’s depiction had none of these. Even the super powers part of “Returns” was all made possible by CGI, there was nothing “super” about Routh’s physique that would lead anyone to assume he had any special powers. Chris Reeve wasn’t that big, but for his time he was considered quite big. Routh looked like a soccer player. And that “dark crimson leather” take on the superman costume didn’t help either: just stick with the original and stop trying to make everything “a more dark and gritty version.” That completely does not work for Superman. His mass appeal was that he was anything BUT dark and gritty. People want to relate to men of virtue: just look at the overwelming popularity of Star Trek, Star Wars, 24, and Halo, all whose lead characters are men of high honor. Honor isn’t some outdated 80’s concept, it is timeless and it never ceases to amaze me how Hollywood doesn’t get that.
“Men of Virtue” and “Men of High Honor”
Now that is a great turn of phrase and completely captures the appeal of Superman.
I think you are right, and I think this is why the idea of a 1930’s period piece (discussed in the comments above) is so popular. Dark works great for Batman, it is not meant for Superman. Superman lives in Metropolis, which is New York in the daylight. Batman lives in Gotham City, which is New York at night. Maybe Batman is a little closer to the truth of the human condition, but Superman is the ideal for which all men secretly hope. We want there to be a man who is good and virtuous and invulnerable and fights for truth, justice, and the American way. I remember sometime after 9/11 somebody mentioned Superman in a conversation, and I started thinking, “boy that’s who we need right now.” Superman could have stopped 9/11, and wouldn’t that have been nice.
It is very difficult to write a story about such a perfect guy and have it be interesting. It’s also uncool to admit to wishing that there really was somebody like Superman around to solve your problems for you. This makes Batman movies easy– the character is automatically cool and interesting. A Superman movie, especially one in the present day, is harder. Superman is basically perfect, and there’s nowhere to go with that. Attempts to make Superman grittier risk becoming “Superman Returns” which, well, missed the mark.
Set Superman in the 30s, though, and the job becomes easier. That was an interesting time, one full of real-world villains and potential imaginary villains that more than make up for Superman’s inherent bland streak. Good was really losing ground in those days. Set a Superman movie in the 30s and he can be the good, virtuous man we all want him to be while still having an interesting enough story to be worth the celluloid.
Good article. But it must be pointed out that since the John Byrne reboot, Superman’s powers have slowly become as great now as they were before 1986. Aside from the teleportation and projection of multiple copies powers shown by Supes and the Kryptonian villains in Superman II, the film incarnation is really no more powerful now then he is in the comics (as far as I know, he never flew around the world to turn back time in the comics, but there does not seem to be any restriction on him doing so if need be). Honestly, the power differences are really negligible. And while there are dark moments in the comics, he is still one of the lightest, if you will, superheroes of all, overall. And as for the alien comment, Superman is, after all, an ALIEN. Five films at a total of eleven plus hours total does not leave much room for aliens all the time–and the enemy in Superman II were his fellow Kryptonians–aliens!
While I appreciate the journalistic effort to point out differences for the purpose of the article, ultimately a disservice is being done when the differences do not really exist.
One movie out of five he fought aliens who weren’t even comic book characters. Zod was created for Superman II. And later adopted into the comics. Five movies and their isn’t a Brainiac in one of them. I agree with this article. Superman is rooted in a lot of sci fi. Whether it be him fighting Aliens, going to Alien planets, fighting gigantic robots that his enemies create, Cyborgs like Metallo. Five movies and you do not see any of this. Besides Lex Luthor they haven’t used any villains or story points from the comic books besides the basic premise.
The first two Superman films are classics of the genre. And the first one will top the lists of many as the greatest super hero film of all time, to this day. The last two sequels are bad, the last one horrific, but, sorry, it really undermines the entire article to have them referred to collectively as “mediocre.”
Superman isn’t the problem…Clark Kent is. They need to make Clark Kent like the George Reeves version. A man and not a doofus. Also make Superman/Kent older (35ish). Lois needs to be hot and believable. Margot Kidder was not hot and Kate Bosworth was not believable. An make Lex Luthor just plain evil, no camp. What the hell, let me direct. Warner Bros. Call me.. or email me!
I love the old George Reeves series too — especially the first season with Phyllis Coates (best Lois Laine ever!). But Reeves’ portrayal of Clark Kent, while charming and sympathetic, always seemed too similar to Superman to be believable as an effective secret-identity.
Part of the brilliance of Christopher Reeve’s performance in the first movie was that he portrayed Clark Kent not as a bumbling fool, but as a man pretending to be a bumbling fool. It’s a very subtle distinction, but it makes all the difference in the world.
I love the old George Reeves series too — especially the first season with Phyllis Coates (best Lois Laine ever!). But Reeves’ portrayal of Clark Kent, while charming and sympathetic, always seemed too similar to Superman to be believable as an effective secret-identity.
Part of the brilliance of Christopher Reeve’s performance in the first movie was that he portrayed Clark Kent not as a bumbling fool, but as a man pretending to be a bumbling fool. It’s a very subtle distinction, but it makes all the difference in the world.
….anybody remember Kirk Allyn? His Superman revelled in his superiority. Every feat was done with energy and joy…a big grin
on his face. Check it out.
Margot was not hot!? Moron, she was super hot back in 70’s. You’ve never seen DePalma’s ‘Sisters’? Her Playboy pictorial? Her hot breasts in ‘Amityville Horror’? Her bathtub masturbation scene in ‘Peter Proud’? You’re a dilettante. You know neither of cinema nor hotness.
By SIII, she was not looking as good, and had upset the producers, who cut her part. Still, in SI and SII, Margot was perfect.
Some of you shouldn’t be allowed to watch movies. You have no taste.
Abso-fricken-lutely. I am so sick of loser-version Clark. He was never that much of a chump in the early serials, cartoons, comic books, George Reeves tv show, or Smallville. Only in the Donner version and it’s sickly child Superman Returns was Clark so pathetic. At least the Donner version compensated with a charming Superman. The Returns version had a pathetic Superman on top of a pathetic Clark.
Every one of David Meisner points were right on. JO
Suits!!! I swear they have no clue. The Dark Knight has a phenomenal, yes. But a large part of that was Heath Ledgers performance as well as his death. The movie itself wasnt that great. The entire part with Two-Face was irrelevant and couldve waited for the sequel. Batman Begins was a much better movie.
Now these suits just jump on anything that is a success and try to emulate it. Avatar is a success, lets make everything 3-D. That must be it. The Dark Knight is a success lets make everything darker. Well, Batman and Superman are VERY different. The formula for one may not take for the other.
The real secret is having a creator behind it that has a PASSION for the project. Why are James Cameron movies hits when Titanic couldnt be further from Avatar… because he has a passion for his projects.
Suits….stop trying to find the magic hit. Its simplefind the creators who have the passion.
You want a successful Superman movie? Try Mark Waid
If The Dark Knight wasn’t so great, then why did it make $1 Billion at the Box Office? Are you kidding me? The Dark Knight was a terrific film that is commonly recognized as the greatest movie based on a comic book ever.
Your assesments and comments are suspect at best.
to cameron tevis
“suits”?…quit trying to make yourself sound relevant within the realm of the movie business…your obviously quoting Entourage, the only source of information about the business you have received
You want to know how to reboot the franchise? Simple, GO READ – Superman Birthright – simple. Translate to film.
But how are you going to take Superman, a hero with near limitless powers, and have him spiritually guided by a director who’s done everything to AVOID those types in his Batman series?
Agreed. Birthright is excellent.
Nolan’s approach works for Batman because Batman’s a mere mortal. Superman is an extraterrestrial being from the planet Krypton. Nolan might be able to help craft a solid Superman story, but he’d have to step away from his Batman-style to do it… and that defeats the purpose of “Nolan-izing” the Superman franchise.
I completely, unreservedly, agree with harm on this one. SUPERMAN: BIRTHRIGHT is my all-time fave Superman story. It’s an “origin” tale but very different from other Supe-origin stories, and with loads of action. It also makes Lex Luthor both interesting and a formidable enemy. Would make an absolutely smash reboot story, to be followed by a sequel in which Superman actually takes on supervillains.
What Randall said. To call the first two movies mediocre is ludicrous and shows a blind contempt for anything that’s not hip and current. Superman The Movie is a classic, and Chris Reeve defined and was inexorably tied to the Superman persona for decades to come.
Don’t d*ck around, get Tom Welling. Just pay the man and make it go. Any of the writers from the last Justice League DVDs could make this rock. Just skip the backstory for once.
Yes, the Justice league cartoon and DVD writers! They could get Superman’s character down cold. But for some idiotic reason, studios refuse to trust the cartoon writers with a live action opportunity. Only Pixar has the understanding that a writer, is a writer, is a writer, regardless of format. If the writers understand the character (and the JL writers do!), then give them a shot at the live action version. Tom Welling has a supremely Superman look and attitude, so if they went with him, I’d be happy. If they went with someone else, I’d keep an open mind until I saw the new guy in trailers. Who plays Superman is important, but not as important as who writes Superman. The Justice League writers are already under the WB umbrella. Why not give them a shot?
“…the mediocre 1978-1985 quartet of movies starring Christopher Reeve and produced by Ilya and Alexander Salkind…”
Huh? The first two Superman movies are pretty well regarded as among the best superhero films ever made. The first blazed a trail that so many others have followed, and the second provided a template for how to do a big budget action adventure with tights. This is all in the 70’s, without the benefit of CGI. And they still hold up.
Of course, the 3rd and 4th showed directors like Joel Schumacher the way to screw up a franchise and run it into the ground by attempting to hard to be funny or campy, or losing sight of what it is about the character that is enduring.
I second the comment from Randall. The first Superman film set precedent on how to make a successful super-hero film minus the camp. It was one of the first of it’s kind and was very successful at the box office. Mediocre isn’t the word I’d use to describe it.
You know if they make Superman darker all you’ll hear about is how much everyone misses the campy Superman that no one really cared that much about in the first place. They should make Red Son.
Just look at superman the animated series by Bruce Timm and they will do ok. That is the man is really knows superman and how to tell a good superman story!!
I agree, call Bruce Timm or Paul Dini, they even had the perfect take on the villains in the animated series and justice league.
Like the third comment, I too have to take issue with the first two films being called mediocre. They both still stand up well and the series was ruined by the truly atrocious third and fourth films.
Nolan’s involvement can only be a good thing. I’m already groaning though at the onslaught of every sci-fi related forum and site being quickly filled with casting suggestions/Routh should stay/Routh should go/Welling for Superman etc etc type postings.
I’m sure Warners/DC will be looking at how Green Lantern develops very closely especially given the presence of aliens that lend themselves to both GL and Supes (and please please no more Lex Luthor related antics).
Mediocre? Did you see both Richard Donner´s Superman and Superman II? Did yo even consider properly original cinematic Richard Lester´s vision in Superman II”? I think you only remember the Cannon B-version of Superman: “Superman IV, the quest for peace” -a complete horror-, and the authentic mediocre movie of the original Warner Bros trilogy: “Superman III”…
I like Singer but Singer and Routh (a VERY appropriate pair as the Insiders will know) gave Superman too much of a fluffing.
Nolan is the best shot at helping deliver the “Superman” Warners has wanted for the past decade.
Speaking of Nolan…it’s JOSHUA Nolan, Mike! JOSHUA! Geez…
LOL. I liked X2,but yeah Singer and girl Routh needed to stay far away from super straight arrow Superman.
agreed
I think letting Nolan handle it is a good idea, but keep in mind that Superman is not Batman. There is no brooding angst. Superman is light compared to Batman’s darkness. Superman is hope and heroism in the face of nihilistic aims of the villains. He’s a combination of Jimmy Stewart and Gregory Peck. Play it straight and check the irony at the door.
Gregory Peck is a great ideal to shoot for.
The two original Superman movies were arguably the best superhero movies ever made. Hardly mediocre.
Problem is, Superman is the dullest ’super’ hero of all-time, totally one dimensional and boring. He has two vulnerabilities – kryptonite and Lois Lane. That’s it. He has no gadgets and no inner struggle. He always knows and does what’s right, with the exception of that brief inner struggle in Superman II that’s now been done. You can count his true adversaries on one hand. So we’re left with very little new to discover and very little character to build on. There’s bugger all to work with for any studio, writer or director that doesn’t dare to make some pretty big changes to the format. The first two Superman films succeeded because they were first, they were products of their time and they had exactly the right mix of playfulness and fantasy – “you’ll believe a man can fly”. But today we believe much more fantastic things and we expect a bit more depth and reality to our heroes. So let’s see what Chris Nolan can do about that…
Have you read a Supes comic in the past 5-10 years? In the hands of a Grant Morrison, even a Jim Lee, he’s a noble and actually extremely compelling character. I give Singer credit for trying to get at some of that, but it didn’t work very well. In an era where “dark” is so predominant, maybe people WANT a clearly heroic character — or was Avatar’s simplistic good-versus-evil moral not dark enough to be embraced by moviegoers?
Oh, wait.
Perhaps this is true of the films, but I think that’s why they need to stick to the source material…
Allstar Superman, Superman: Last Son, Superman: Brainiac, Final Crisis: Superman Beyond and Superman: Secret Origins are all recent comic titles that are all full of Villains that can challenge Superman both physically and psychologically.
They explore Superman’s vulnerabiltiies and add a real weight to his beliefs and struggles. Plenty to work with if they ask the right people – Just hire Geoff Johns and Grant Morrison to help with the script.
There is so much wrong with your comment, I hardly know where to begin…
Superman is the dullest ’super’ hero of all-time, totally one dimensional and boring.
Well, you’re certainly entitled to that opinion, but it sounds pretty ignorant to me. Especially since Superman has been, hands down, the most popular superhero worldwide for over 70 years. How much of that seventy-plus year history are you familiar with? Have you read any of the titles by Alan Moore, John Byrne, Mark Waid, Grant Morrison, or Mark Millar? Or the recent novel by Tom DeHaven? Not to mention the classic radio and TV stories from the Golden and Silver Ages? Or the outstanding animated adventures from the iconic Max Fleischer films of the 1940’s to the modern-day Justice League series produced by Bruce Timm & Paul Dini? If your only knowledge of the Man of Steel comes from the live-action movies, you’ve still got a lot to learn.
He has two vulnerabilities – kryptonite and Lois Lane. That’s it.
Not quite. Superman’s powers are fueled by radiation from the Earth’s yellow sun. If that radiation is removed for an extended period of time, he loses his powers. Also, despite what we’ve seen in some of the previous films, Superman cannot survive indefinitely without breathable air. In the comics, extended periods underwater or in outer space require him to wear a pressure suit. Furthermore, Superman has no special defense against magical or god-like powers, and in many of the older stories he could be incapacitated by an overwhelming electric shock or nuclear blast. But often his greatest vulnerability is his overwhelming compassion — not just for Lois, but for all of humanity. Thus, Superman can often be manipulated by cynical villains like Luthor who are not restrained by a similar moral code or empathic nature.
That’s quite a few Achilles heels when you think about it. Certainly enough to tell interesting stories for over seventy years.
He always knows and does what’s right, with the exception of that brief inner struggle in Superman II that’s now been done.
I would hardly call Superman’s agonizing decision to sacrifice his powers for a normal life with Lois a “brief inner struggle.” It is the driving force of that whole film. Regardless, there is little evidence in the vast cannon of Superman stories to support your claim that he always knows and does what’s right. Perhaps this was true in the old TV shows and Saturday morning cartoons, but in the comic books Superman is constantly aware of the great responsibilities that come with powers and often worries that he lacks the wisdom and experience to use them properly. This is why he is always seeking advice from father-figures (Jor-El, Pa Kent) on how to best serve humanity. In fact, this is a dominant theme throughout all the Christopher Reeve films. For example, at the climax of the first movie, Superman is paralyzed by inner conflict — he wants to turn back the world and bring Lois back to life but he is held in check by Jor-El’s command that he not use his powers to change the course of human history. Could there be a clearer example of Superman not knowing what is the right thing to do? In the end, he follows his heart and explictly does what he was taught not to do.
You can count his true adversaries on one hand.
Then you must have a lot of extra fingers on your hands because right of the top of my head I can name the following: Lex Luthor, Brainiac, Darkseid, Bizarro, Metallo, Mr. Mxyzptlk, Lobo, General Zod, Doomsday and Solomon Grundy. And those are just the heavyweights. But even if your point were true, so what? You can count Sherlock Holmes “true” adversaries on one hand but that doesn’t mean you can’t still make a great Sherlock Holmes film. Right?
So we’re left with very little new to discover and very little character to build on.
Only if you are blind, deaf and dumb.
There’s bugger all to work with for any studio, writer or director that doesn’t dare to make some pretty big changes to the format.
That’s exactly what movie execs have been saying for the past twenty years. They don’t know shit about Superman either.
The first two Superman films succeeded because they were first, they were products of their time and they had exactly the right mix of playfulness and fantasy – “you’ll believe a man can fly”.
That’s part of it. But more importantly, those films succeeded because they were made by a filmmaker (Richard Donner) who understood and respected the source material. That crucial understanding and respect is evident in every aspect of those films, from the writing and casting all the way down to the music and costumes. Whenever Superman has failed at the box office, it is almost always because, despite good intentions, someone has tried to re-invent the legend.
But today we believe much more fantastic things and we expect a bit more depth and reality to our heroes. So let’s see what Chris Nolan can do about that…
I’ll drink to that!
Why is there never any mention of Smallville when talking about a Superman reboot?! Tom Welling has played the character for nearly ten years and has done an amazing, exceptional job. I as well as many other Smallville fans would love to see him transition to the big screen and a reboot of the franchise. I would hate to see yet another actor play Superman rather than sticking with one actor for several movies (i.e., the awful 80’s Batman franchise with four(?) separate actors?!). Routh did an okay job but Tom Welling would be my pick. And if they’re looking for script ideas, the Smallville series is reaching a place where a “reboot” (or just continuation of the series) onto the big screen would be appropriate. The characters and villains introduced on Smallville have been a lot more intruiging and believable than the campy villains in the Superman movies, including Superman Returns.
I approve of everything you’ve said. This would be the way to go forward.
Smallville is Smallvile, not Superman. make a smallvile movie and make a superman movie. fans of small will be happy and fans of sups will be happy.
I hear you and agree with you, Tom is the man
Indeed, keep Singer as far from this as possible. Better yet, get Nolan to direct and Proyas to write it. Let’s get some grit under those super-hard fingernails and a hot Lois Lane who won’t take no for an answer.
And by all means consider using Brainiac, particularly if they follow the story line from the Superman animated series: after arriving on Earth Brainiac tries to get on Supermans good side with data about Krypton, then ‘collaborates’ with Luthor before screwing him into the ground by taking over his corporate computer.
IMO that would be one helluva jumping off point.
Superman II was great and was a little on the darker side.
Something like that would work again.
It amazes me how much studios keep saying that it is so hard to do a Superman story. In the comics alone, beginning with the phenomenal John Byrne series, Superman has had great storylines that could easily be made into equally great movies. The character of Lex Luthor as Superman’s main antagonist works if he is given an advantage over the man of steel, such as having him a billionaire industrialist. Nolan is a marvelous director and did an amazing job with the Batman, but I worry that having him produce Superman as well may be too much for him to handle – but then again – he may prove to be the true Superman himself! Best of luck! It would be great to see the Big Blue fly right after the last debacle!
I meant to post this on this thread:
I’m actually really loving the addition of Mike Fleming to the blog. Many of the posts (surely the ones he writes) are much more informative and positive—or at least not so overwhelmingly negative and hateful. It’s refreshing to read the facts with a bit of editorial peppered in without feeling depressed from such manic negativity. Thanks Mike!!
It needs to have some unknown all-American actor with a not too exciting (read..tabloid material) offscreen personality and has to fit the stereotypical boyscout 30s,40s “American” profile – exactly in the Reeve mould.
Superman returns..was somewhat comical. When a movie makes you laugh when its not supposed to, you have a failure on your hands. Though Brandon Routh is not to be blamed for the silly oprah-style storyline, he’s credible as superman.
“Superman Returns” was just way too greasy. Most fan-boys like to see buxom gals. Even “Smallville” knows how to portray beautiful women on screen. Good riddance to Singer.
The excitement surrounding the release of the first “Superman” movie was the magic of seeing a comic book character, treated with respect.
…buxom huh?…then lets include Power Girl!
Hey Warner Brothers: The guy to do justice to the man of steel on the big screen is …. wait for it … BRUCE TIMM. He has already shown he gets the character and he gets the concept and he knows how to bring them to life outside of comic books. Going from animation to live actors with special effects is not a huge leap. Richard Fleischer (director of the original Superman animated shorts) did it.
The movie needs to be done in the foot steps of Smallville,……..
Superman Returns gave me the first impression that Superman belonged more on a ballet stage than fighting bad guys. They’d better man-up the main character or else the next one will flop too.
Amen
NIKKI, Mike really must be influencing your articles. I thought you don’t do geek!
Leonardo Superman?!?!? MY GAWD. That is like listening Barry Manilow do a Led Zep song. WHAT A KILLER!
The first two with Christopher Reeve (RIP) were dead-on; the studio came down with sequel-itis after that. The Routh movie was a bigger-budgeted re-do of the Superman v. Luthor part of the original movie, with the subplot that he’d knocked up Lois before leaving for umpteen years and now had a half-breed son to deal with. (our true-blue hero? NOT)
Jon Peters’ reported ideas on the Superman films only indicate an utter lack of interest in keeping to the source material, which defect has killed many comics-based movies [ see X-Men 3, Superman 3 and 4, .... ].
“Truth, Justice and the American Way!” Get back on that theme and stick with it. Damn what Europe thinks! Enough of this chicken-s**t Hollywood political correctness. WE are the greatest nation on Earth. It’s time to start acting that way again! We need more John Wayne’s and fewer Johnny Depp’s. Speaking of which, is it just me, or does he always look like he needs a bath? Except when he’s in character, (Depp)that is!
This is going to be a long post so bear with me. I have very mixed feelings about this. For a long time I thought that a reboot of the franchise would be a mistake simply for the fact that the 2006 movie is still well liked in some circles. Its not a total washout as some people like to think it is. For me personally I didn’t like ‘Returns’ all that much, it wasn’t bad, but it wasn’t good either, just ‘meh’. Yet I still believe that a decent sequel can be made but some risky choices have to be made, like somehow getting rid of superboy, be done with Lex Luthor and no more mention of kryptonite. But as we all know studios are risk averse.
Now for the Nolan factor. Its a good idea because first and foremost the guy is a storyteller. He puts on a classy show everytime he comes out. But…I think his insistence on realism might be a detriment to the Superman property. If that’s going to be the case, I don’t know. For those who don’t read the comics let me start off by saying that Superman is essentially SCI-FI FANTASY DRAMA. That means the more fantastic the better. Where with Batman its gritty crime drama. The Batman’s mythos fits like a glove in the real world. Strange, yet plausible.
In order to do right by the man of steel you have to go broad. The material demands it. Bryan Singer’s mistake was that he shoehorned a mundane familial aspect to the story that detracted from the wonder of the Superman mythos. He brought Superman down to our level. That’s a no-no. Realism has no place in the world of Superman. Nolan has to become an 8 year old kid again. Evil gigantic robots. Mindless Mutant monsters. Intergalatic Alien Warriors. Planet size crashing meteors. Manta rays. That’s Superman folks, whether you like it or not. Villains and situations must be larger than life where no one can stand a chance at overcoming…except for Superman. Follow that formula and Warners has a massive hit.
Awesome post. Well thought out.
I didn’t agree with everything in it. But definately see where your coming from
As soon as they scrapped Superman’s signature “the American way” I knew I was out. That’s not the Superman I grew up with, and I’m not interested in any other post-modern, post-American version of him either. These Hollytards have no right to usurp a great traditional character like that and replace him with their Leftwing golem.
Post-modern? Post-American?
You need to check your history, bub.
In the original comic books (created by two left-wing, Jewish kids from Cleveland) Superman was originally portrayed as a dangerous vigilante who operated outside the law and didn’t hesitate to hurt or kill criminals for the greater good. Furthermore, he was explicitly described a “champion of the weak and oppressed” who fought on behalf of the working man against corrupt government and greedy big buisness. It wasn’t until WWII that Superman was co-opted by the conservative establishment and transformed into the ultra-patriotic symbol of “Truth, Justice, and the American way.”
Indeed, the pre-war Superman who tore down slums and fought for workers rights would no doubt be branded a dangerous socialist by the right-wing, Tea Party crowd that so reveres him today.
Ironic, huh? Now you know.
A lot of people felt this way.
man i hope they make the right calls this time around. I was pretty pissed with how singer messed it up with returns. Hopefully nolan will get good writers/director and get the direction in the right place.
Superman started off as a hero and quickly developed to an icon. Batman was brought on later to be the almost exact opposite of Superman. While both were orphans, Superman never knew his parents, while Batman had his viciously taken away. Superman is an alien with super powers trying to fit in (fish out of water) while Batman is a human with no powers distancing himself from humanity through his anti-social behavior. Superman attacks problems head-on with brute strength, Batman investigates and thinks through problems like a real detective. This is why in the comics these two NEVER get along — Superman is “the big blue boy scout” while Bats is the kid at the back of the class that is smarter than everybody else but doesn’t care what anyone else thinks. Superman is fearless because he is indestructible, while Batman knows fear well enough to use it as a weapon. I will be disappointed if the Superman reboot is campy, but I think the edge to take on it is how his trying to fit in drives everything he does as Superman to the point of obsession and even distraction.
Totally agree! I really don’t want to see an origin movie as a reboot, but using Superman 2 as a template, they can create something awesome.
Superman had that “American” value type thing going which is why everyone loved him, and the battle that ensues, which shows the vulnerabilities of Superman and the incredible powers as well with the 3 villians is thus far the best method of makeing a superman movie that allows us to relate in terms of vulnerabilities, such as sacrifice for love and the american way and all that shit is by putting supes up against some out of this world battle. The superman dies story does this quite well in it’s own way. I’d love to see them do that story, or something along those lines.
I can’t figure out why these companies, that have access to incredible source material can’t get shit right? To me, it’s like you have an entire encyclopedia on these characters, you have really centuries and centuries of literature and a built-in audience especially when it comes to Superman, Batman, Spiderman, Xmen etc… I mean just don’t give us cheap effects, and don’t mess the source material too much and we’ll love it. Dark Knight, Spiderman 1,2 and Xmen 1,2 they got it right. I find it hard to believe these companies can’t do it right when really it’s right there on a silver platter for the taking.
Actually, Batman was brought in to cash in on the success of Superman one year after his release. Quite ironic when you think about it – now they want to cash in on Batman by using Superman.
Hey, Jon Peters is involved? Good! There’s no way he can screw up a major comic book movie. Oh, wait
Yeah, Jon Peters has a history of screwing up the Superman re-boots. Just listen to this story, told by Kevin Smith (who took a crack at the script during the Tim Burton/Nicholas Cage pre-production).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgYhLIThTvk
Fk! There is no way this movie will be good with that douche attached. He’s never produced a good movie.
See, this is why SUperman Retyurns was a fail. Hollywood just doesn’t get it. It’s always trying to make things “edgier!”. That is absolutely idiotic. The reason people loved Superman was BECAUSE of his traditional values & boy scout goodness. He was a real hero to look up to. If you watch the first to movies, you notice it’s humanity that’s all morally askew, but Superman always walks the straight & narrow. The reaosn the last one failed is EXACTLY because of this. No “American way”. A bastard child with Lois?!?! Come on!! This hero is not like Batman, agonizing in self-doubt for hours upon end. “Let’s not make his cape red, but a dark maroon! Let’s not make his suit bright blue, but a dark navy. People will relate to him more!” People don’t WANT to relate to him! They want to look up to him. They don’t want to be able to understand the faillings of him. They want to look up to him & say “I need to be more like hi8m. He’s my hero.” If Hollwood continues to try & make it “edgier” once agaiey’ll just fail again, waste millions, and never learn. Also, the stupid video game CGI effects of him darting back & forth in the sky don’t help!
“the original movie nailed it, from the Kansas boyhood to Clark Kent’s debut on the streets of Metropolis…really the character needs to stay close to his 30s-40s roots, a period piece wouldn’t be out of the question”
I TOTALLY AGREE. The first movie was perfect, as far as presenting Supe’s boyhood and his Metropolis debut. Watching that part of the film still sends chills up your spine. Then they screwed it all up, as Clark Kent suddenly became a doofus and Lex Luthor a comical idiot. Even worse, the sequels were mostly geared to 7 year olds. Hollywood also badly screwed up the most recent Superman film. I am really hopeful they will finally realize this character deserves the proper treatment…
Who cares about how good a movie is? It’s only about the money – pathetic! Superman is completely different from Batman, and all the film guys who have tried to make a Superman movie shows just how hard it is to develop the film.
Batman is about Gotham but Superman encapsulates the whole universe: how can you write a killer story which has such a diverse range of subjects to choose from? Superman Returns focused on a love story and even though the reviews had been great, everyone seems to just want a teenage focused movie where Superman is just fighting Aliens. How impressive.
We just have to wait and see how developments are made with this…
I can imagine a Superman movie set in the 50′ s. This would be a perfect era due to the Cold War and lack of common everyday devices we now use.
See, this is why Superman Returns was a fail. Hollywood just doesn’t get it. It’s always trying to make things “edgier!”. That is absolutely idiotic. The reason people loved Superman was BECAUSE of his traditional values & boy scout goodness. He was a real hero to look up to. If you watch the first to movies, you notice it’s humanity that’s all morally askew, but Superman always walks the straight & narrow. The reason the last one failed is EXACTLY because of this. No “American way”. A bastard child with Lois?!?! Come on!! This hero is not like Batman, agonizing in self-doubt for hours upon end. “Let’s not make his cape red, but a dark maroon! Let’s not make his suit bright blue, but a dark navy. People will relate to him more!” People don’t WANT to relate to him! They want to look up to him. They don’t want to be able to understand the failings of him. They want to look up to him & say “I need to be more like him. He’s my hero.” If Hollwood continues to try & make it “edgier” once again they’ll just fail again, waste millions, and never learn. Also, the stupid video game CGI effects of him darting back & forth in the sky don’t help!
RICHARD DONNER MADE SUPERMAN
RICHARD DONNER MADE SUPERMAN
RICHARD DONNER MADE SUPERMAN
RICHARD DONNER MADE SUPERMAN
GOOD LUCK TO ALL NEWCOMERS
They’ll need it!
Superman Returns lost me when I saw the low-rise bikini-style tights Routh was wearing.
Then, when Perry snidely says, “Truth, Justice, and… all that OTHER stuff,” I checked out.
Superman is synonymous with America and “the American Way.”
If a director and writing team don’t get that, they have to business helming a Superman movie.
“Truth, Justice, and… all that OTHER stuff,”
I had COMPLETELY forgotten about that line in this horribly forgetful film. I hate you for resurrecting a terrible memory but appreciate the reminder of what happens when things get too PC…too “Okay guys. How do we cater to ALL territories??”
The one responsible for that line should be pushed out of the plane somewhere over N. Korea.
god that line was horrible. If you don’t have the balls to say the motto right, just leave it out altogether. Don’t punk out and spit in the face of generations of Superman fans just because you’re too chickensh!t to do the line right.
Superman is American, Zorro is Spanish, and James Bond is British. Why should Superman be changed to some type of UN hero? I know, “Marketability”
JO
Good move by Warner to pass over Burton and Ratner, both couldn’t do it. Nolan is a better choice, but better not make Superman as dark as Batman, or we’ll all be in trouble.
This just made my morning. Thanks for the scoop, Nikki!
Jeff Robinov: “we have to look at how to make these movies edgier”.
Then you’re going to fail again, lose millions of dollars, & I can’t WAIT to see it happen. Sorry if the “squeaky clean, campiness” makes you uncomfortable. Don’t give the fans what they want (measured by every successful incarnation of Superman….MEDIOCRE?!). Try to reinvent Superman into a “darker” character. Please. Make the man of steel edgy. It will bring me joy to watch that fail again!!!!!
Robinov has since clarified that remark:
Edgier = More Sophisticated
Which seems about right to me. Now that Nolan is involved, I think they’re on the right track.
While it had some weaknesses, I liked Superman Returns. If they can stay far away from the cheesy, the campy, the silly, and keep it strong, it’ll be a good product. Christopher Reeves was hoping to do one more Superman based on the Doomsday plot. That story had multiplot lines and lots of action, just right for a new Superman movie.
Superman 3 and 4 were lousy. Superman Returns had promise.
My main gripes were Lois (who was too angsty and not sassy enough), supermans love child and a mixture of too comicy which flipped to quite violent (Superman being kicked to near death – I liked this bit actually). The writing was wrong.
Bryan Singer from a visual standpoint directed the film very well.
Also Brandon Routh saved this film, despite his screen time being too limited.
Very intriguing development… I am still skeptical as to whether or not WB can interweave D.C. Comic properties as seamlessly as Marvel Studios is doing but this is a step in the right direction… now all us comic book geeks need is a hot scoop on who Marvel will be casting as Captain America! Big rumours on Chad Michael Murray, Captain Awesome from Chuck and Jensen Ackles being the final three are going around… how about a confirmation or denial at least?
You wrote: We were told that “Bryan or Brandon are not completely out of it yet. But Warner Bros doesn’t have a handle yet on it, either. [Producer] Jon Peters is trying to make something happen since he stands to benefit financially. But they [the studio] need to hear a great story that makes sense.”
Is that current or as of last summer? It’s hard to tell in the story. Thanks.
That’s from last summer. Earlier in the article it says expressly this movie will have nothing (thankfully) to do with SUPERMAN RETURNS.
Hey, maybe the next Superman can be as dark, grim and sadistic as Nolan’s Batman movies!
I like Nolan for this job, because he seems to take the spirit of the characters seriously, and not as a vehicle for his own whims and notions. As for taking the character into darker territory, well, Superman has always been a ray of sunshine in a dark world. That’s the angle they should look into. A noble hero, an ideal, who lives in a world that doesn’t appreciate noble ideals.
Also, bring in Brainiac. The movies need Brainiac.
I think you need to post a retraction on that “mediocre” description of the original Superman movies. The first two Superman films were absolutely epic classics. The special effects were some of the most groundbreaking ever and the cast was absolute genius. The Mario Puzo script and Richard Donner’s direction grounded the films in believable reality as opposed to childishness or camp. If they hadn’t taken that approach, the superhero genre in modern films would not exist as we know it today. The original Superman became the model almost all superhero movies in the 2000s decade followed (after the fad of Burton’s Batman wore off and filmmakers realized they needed story, character and faithfulness to the comic books, not just flashy visual effects).
Chris Nolan himself has held up the original Superman as an inspiration for his Batman reboot. Nolan said, “It had this great cast, and it treated its subject with a real degree of respect, not selling it short as just a comic book movie.” “These movie stars—the Al Pacinos, the Michael Caines, Gary Oldmans, Liam Neesons—they can make the audience feel all the things you’re trying to put in there and get the richness of the story. That was something I also got from the Dick Donner film [Superman] when I looked at that cast—Susannah York, Glenn Ford, Marlon Brando, Ned Beatty, it’s a superb cast.”
Also, the first Superman in adjusted domestic dollars remains the 5th highest-grossing superhero film of all time and the 31st highest grossing film of all time in worldwide adjusted dollars (according to ibrarules’ worldwide adjusted calculations on IMDB). It wasn’t a “mediocre” movie and neither was its box office performance.
She called “Superman 3″ mediocre: read more closely.
Read more early. You probably didn’t see what was originally written when the piece first went up. That’s what everyone is commenting on. I even quoted it, verbatim, in my comment of February 9, 2010 @ 8:26 am, “…the mediocre 1978-1985 quartet of movies starring Christopher Reeve and produced by Ilya and Alexander Salkind…”
The author, probably in response to the reaction of the posters, has since edited that characterization of the first four films.
Superman Returns was a disaster. Singer’s a dumbass for putting “Truth, Justice, all that stuff?”
What was that idiot thinking other than more hatred for the American way?
It’s time for Warner to get serious and buy out the Seigel and Shuster families with a big fat check. Can you imagine Disney licensing Mickey Mouse from the family of Ub Iwerks? No.
The first issue or superman and the first two weeks of the daily strip will soom be the property of the heirs. In this material the key intellectual property for Superman is established: Superman, Clark Kent, Kal-L, Jor-L, Krypton(it’s destruction and the rocket to earth), Lois Lane, Daily Star Newspaper, the basic costume design, secret identity, and many concepts that are the foundation of the character.
Beyond being an icon, Superman is a multi-billion dollar corporate asset and it’s time for Warner to view as such. Allowing Superman ownership to lapse back to the heirs will measurably damage the value of DC Comics and Warner. Put the continuing lawsuits to bed once and for all and honor the creators by settling with the families for a fair amount.
I’d say the problem with Superman Returns was ego. The director came in with no doubt that his take on things would satisfy, and never looked back. Then again, you can’t have someone who just tries to please everybody and then inevitably fails. Nolan meets this balance. I just hope the whole thing is true.
The S man is Ok, but I’d rather have a really steady diet of 5 or 6 Batmans.with the same lead actor.
What Hollywood never gets is that super hero movies don’t need an origin/ backstory to appear in every film. Do most people know Superman came from Krypton? That he was raised in Kansas? Of course. A good one third of the film is taken up with retelling the same old yarn. Super movies suck because by the time Clark meets Lois, falls in love, there’s no time to tell a compelling story.
Want to make a great Superman movie? Begin with the imminent destruction of Earth. Superman is fighting a losing battle and he’s fading fast from exposure to kryptonite. Lois is in a spaceship headed toward the sun. All seems lost. Gimme something to get excited about. Screw the messianic B.S. give us a an action packed, roller coaster ride.
Part of the problem with Superman is after Lex Luthor, he doesn’t have any great advisories. Brainiac and Bizzaro are pretty one dimensional. The only one that comes close is borrowed from Jack Kirby’s Forth World — the all powerful Darkseid.
Make that movie, and I’ll come to see it.
Can we please have a MAN play Superman? And can his cape please be RED? And can he please fight for truth, justice and the AMERICAN way?
The first Superman was excellent, then the franchise went downhill. The last one was too CGI and not very intertaining. I’d rather see real people with some lighter moments. Chris Reeve MADE Superman FLY. The last one was more fake looking than the George Reeves series of the 50’s.
Here’s an idea. Stay away from stupid real estate deals concocted by Lex Luther. When I sat through Singer’s stinker I couldn’t believe what I was seeing. He had the entire DC Superman comics catalog available to him, and he comes up with the villain from the first film doing something very similar.
Maybe Nolan can do this, but WB does not inspire me with confidence that it has any clues on how it can be done.
Agree – a Superman reboot needs to take him back to the comic book interpretation and away from the Hollywood-wimpy-metrosexual-big studio interpretation. And, while Lex Luthor is a great character, perhaps the Superman reboot could have a different villain for a change? Nolan went with Ra’s Al Ghul and Scarecrow for Batman Begins, two great but lesser-known villians to those not familiar with Batman comics. Superman has a vast collection of villians that could be used in the next movie.