This was released by SAG on Wednesday, November 26th:
Why should we vote to authorize a strike?
We need to show management that we are willing to fight to preserve our ability to earn a living as union performers;otherwise, management will take that away from us. Nearly half of our earnings as union performers come from residuals, but management wants us to allow them to make programs for the Internet and other new media non-union and with no residuals. This means that as audiences shift from watching us on their televisions to watching us on their computers and cell phones our ability to earn a living will go away and future generations of actors may never be able to earn a living through their craft. This change will happen faster than you think. To add insult to injury, management also insists that we eliminate force majeure protections from our contract. These protections have existed since the first SAG contract in 1937 and protect you when production stops as the result of an “act of God” like a natural disaster or a strike by another union, such as the WGA strike earlier this year. This is an enormous rollback that will leave actors without one of the most basic protections of a union contract.What is the effect of voting “yes” to authorize a strike?
Voting “yes” does not mean that there will automatically be a strike. A strike authorization is a tool that gives us more leverage in negotiations and we intend to use it to try to get a fair deal. If we receive “yes” votes from at least 75% of the members who vote on this referendum, the National Board will have the ability to call a strike, but it must vote to do that, and that won’t happen before we attempt further negotiations to reach a deal with management. Why does management believe we should endorse non-union, residual-free work in New Media?
Management claims this bad deal is necessary because they need to “experiment” with new media and they claim they will renegotiate these terms with us in the future. We have already agreed to most of management’s new media terms, however, and have proposed, in the areas where we still disagree, extremely flexible terms for new media based on our successful low budget theatrical contracts and our nearly 800 made-for-new media contracts with independent producers. Our terms will allow management the latitude to experiment using union actors.And how can we believe that management will ever improve these new media terms when they still won’t improve the home video residual formula after 22 years? Right now all the actors on a given cast share 1% of the revenue generated through DVD sales because of a formula we agreed to in 1986 when management needed to “experiment” with home video. In this negotiation, we have asked only that management at least make pension and health contributions on DVD residuals, rather than making us pay them ourselves out of our paltry 1%. They have refused even that!
The basic cable residual formula was also negotiated early in the history of that medium to reflect the then “experimental” status of basic cable programming and pays only a small fraction of network television residuals. It is now over 20 years later, 27% of all television ad dollars are now spent on basic cable, and the basic cable formula still pays only a small fraction of network television residuals. Management simply does not have a history of ever ending their “experiments” and paying us fairly.
The reality is that management is opportunistic and they believe they can force these concessions on us because they believe we are weak and divided. We need your vote to prove them wrong.
Don’t all these terms just go away at the end of 3 years anyway because management has agreed to a “sunset clause”?
All the “sunset clause” means is that if management wants to maintain in future negotiations the bad new media deal they want to force on us now, they must write those terms down on a piece of paper and give it to us as a proposal. Do you really believe that this will provide us with any protection in a future negotiation if management decides that they like making non-union, residual-free programs in new media? The fact is that once management establishes a business model that relies upon non-union, residual-free production, it will be even harder to change their minds. Just look at how hard they continue to fight to avoid improving the home video formula, well after DVD’s have become their richest source of revenue.Haven’t the other Hollywood unions accepted this deal already? Why do we need a better deal?
We are not looking for a “better” deal. We are looking for a deal that is different and that recognizes the unique needs of actors. No other union represents the actors who appear in motion pictures or the actors who account for over 95% of the earnings in primetime network television. While management likes to pretend, when it suits them, that “pattern bargaining” is somehow obligatory for unions in this industry, the fact is that we have a legal right to negotiate our own contract. And for good reason—the “pattern,” in many cases, affects us differently:The impact of sanctioning non-union made-for-new media programs is different for us. Many performers must rely on the collective bargaining power of the union to obtain fair terms of employment. Unlike the writer or director, a day performer or background actor may not have the leverage to negotiate fair terms for themselves. Performers, especially stunt performers, also have health and safety issues on the set that aren’t shared by writers or directors and they rely on the union to look out for them. And unlike writers or directors, our union faces a significant threat from non-union performers who want to provide producers with an alternative workforce they can use to make their product without having to comply with union terms and conditions. Allowing our employers to make non-union new media productions will allow these non-union actors to gain credits and experience, which will make non-union production easier and more attractive and thereby reduce the opportunities for union actors like us to get work.
Allowing residuals-free new media production also impacts performers differently. Unlike writers and directors, most performers don’t earn enough in initial compensation to live on. Instead, we rely on residuals to get us through the lean times. As production inevitably shifts from traditional media to new media, the lack of residuals in new media will eventually choke off that vital source of income that enables us to stay in the profession even when we aren’t working so that we can audition, hone our craft and remain available for new roles. In such a world, many of us will be reduced to amateurs working day jobs to support our acting habit.
There are already lots of differences between management’s new media proposal to us and their deals with the DGA and WGA. For example, management has agreed to set minimum payments for writers of made-for-new media programs, but refuses to do so for actors. Why doesn’t the pattern apply to this critical issue? There are other differences. The minimum residual for a TV show rerun on the Internet for six months is over $600 for a director or a writer, but only $22.77 for an actor who works as a day player. On the other hand, use of clips of an actor’s work on the Internet requires consent by the actor, but a director’s or writer’s work can be used as a clip on the Internet without their consent. Is that better, worse or just different? Management talks about their new media template like it is exactly the same for each union and can’t be changed. In fact, management has proposed varying new media provisions to different unions when it suited them, but they have refused when we have proposed reasonable and modest changes, like making sure all made-for-new media productions are done union and pay residuals.
Are we sure that we have exhausted every opportunity to make a deal before asking for this authorization?
We shouldn’t have to exhaust every opportunity to make a deal before asking for a strike authorization. Most successful unions ask for a strike authorization early on, sometimes before they even start bargaining, because management is more likely to take the union seriously if they know the members are willing to fight. We didn’t do that this time because the WGA strike had just ended, but our union needs to get back to the routine practice of approving a strike authorization well before we get to the expiration of the current contract. Actors elected by the membership to the SAG National Board decide by a vote if and when a strike should be called.As it happens, we have absolutely exhausted every possible opportunity to make a deal before asking for this authorization. We spent 42 days between April and July in hard bargaining with the AMPTP. In the months that followed, we bargained informally, met with CEO’s and educated our membership about the issues. Finally, we asked for a federal mediator to intervene. After nearly a month, management agreed to return to the bargaining table for a marathon mediation session that ran late into the night on two consecutive days until the mediator finally declared that it was pointless to continue.
After all of that, management’s positions on the fundamental issues at stake in this negotiation are the same as they were on the first day of bargaining. On the other hand, we have pared down our demands, made painful concessions and offered compromise after compromise, all to no avail. It is crystal clear that without the support of our membership for this authorization, we will have no choice to but swallow whatever management sees fit to give us lock, stock and barrel.
Is a strike really feasible considering how bad the economy is right now?
The bad economy hurts management just as much as it hurts us. As uncertain and anxious as our employers are about the future of their businesses and of their own jobs, the prospect of a SAG membership willing to go to the mat and fight them is the last thing they want. Yes, the bad economy means that it will require more of a sacrifice from some of our members if in fact a strike becomes necessary, but remember that this union was founded and obtained its first contract during the depths of the Great Depression. Hard times do not mean that we stop demanding fair treatment from management.What can I do to help?
Vote “yes” on the strike authorization referendum. It’s our best hope of obtaining a fair contract. Talk to your fellow SAG members wherever you can find them and convince them to vote “yes” too. Read your email and visit the SAG website to stay informed and learn about town hall meetings and other events in your area and make sure you attend. Better yet, bring another member with you. If you can’t attend, or prefer to express yourself in writing, email your thoughts and suggestions to contracts2008@sag.org. And most importantly, stay strong. Do not let management intimidate you into accepting less than you deserve. If we stay united, we will prevail.


The AMPTP won’t take us seriously unless we authorize a strike.
That’s why they are doing everything they can, including using the economy to try to frighten us into submission, to keep us from approving this.
It is critical for SAG members to vote YES. It doesn’t mean there will be a strike but means that our elected board members have the authority to call one only as a last resort.
Don’t underestimate the message authorizing a strike will send to the shareholders of the big media companies in an economy like this one.
If we authorize one, the big institutional investors will be on the phone the next day telling the moguls to order the AMPTP to wrap up a deal.
These investors have already seen their investments go into the tank, and are in no mood for a strike. This is a headache they don’t need. If you were a stockholder of CBS, Viacom, News Corp. GE, Sony or Disney would you want the AMPTP negotiators tempting fate and risking your investment over what to these companies is a relatively small amount of money?
Let’s get real specific instead of talking about AMPTP…How long do you think Mr. Redstone can stomach a strike?…How long will Mr. Redstone’s creditor’s allow a strike? For that matter, how long will those holding the notes for any of the media companies allow a strike? Look how GM is being treated, can you imagine how GE would be treated if they went looking for a bailout?
a question:
why is it that no one has voiced the OUTRAGE some of us feel about this town being continually SHUT DOWN
by individuals who spend most of their times waiting tables?
as an art director i have never voted or shut down this town by a strike.
i’ve never been responsible for people defaulting on their mortgages, closing businesses or leading to productions leaving l.a.
Can ANY actor say the same?
if there were a way to do without actors and their incessant destruction of what little business remains in this funereal town, i wish someone would figure it out.
“Unique need” = primadonnas!
The AMPTP is relying on scare tactics and disinformation to demoralize its opponents. Don’t allow it to affect you. The AMPTP is doing all of this just to gain a fraction of a penny per share of value for its masters over the long term, and to provide Counter with a dose of natural Viagra.
Give ‘em a cold shower, SAG! Give ‘em hell!
It is certainly possible that the AMPTP is only bluffing and has major concerns about an SAG strike. It is also possible that the major media companies have coldly ran thier financial numbers and believe that they can weather a strike. As a fan, I simply hope everything is resolved so that the upcoming season of LOST is not affected.
Instead of SAG spending all their time writing up and sending out press releases every single day (including Thanksgiving lol), perhaps their time would be better spent actually, you know, negotiating to prevent a strike.
I agree with everything SAG is saying in this Q&A, but was Thanksgiving really the best day to post this?
Just A Thought– that’s about the dumbest post I’ve seen yet. SAG has made countless concessions to get a deal done; the studios and networks… ZERO.
Q: Is there any more of that kool-aid available?
A: Of course there is…plenty for all!!!
I’m not buying your crap today SAG. I especially loved the “We are not looking for a “better” deal. We are looking for a deal that is different”…that one made my day!
If it wasn’t so sad, it might be funny. Can we combine the picket line with a soup kitchen for all the unemployed BTL members?
This is a terrible time to strike. It will hurt an enormous ammount of people, a fraction of them being SAG members, the only ones with anything to gain. If we don’t authorize to strike, we will be weaker and get a deal that is substandard. I agree with that. But the world does not revolve around us and our residuals. Us getting just the right deal is not worth the damage a strike would cause. We and our deal are not the most important thing in the world. We have to sacrifice this opportunity to keep this industry moving. Even if it means walking away with less than we want. There is nothing in the world more important to America’s health at this moment than jobs. Take the shitty deal so that people can keep working. It’s our duty, whether we like it or not. If we win, too many other people lose.
Wow.
Guess real people were busy at thanksgiving, while the AMPTP’s sock puppets were busy commenting here.
“Allowing our employers to make non-union new media productions will allow these non-union actors to gain credits and experience, which will make non-union production easier and more attractive and thereby reduce the opportunities for union actors like us to get work.”
Yeah, it would suck if actual motivated people that rely on their talent and initiative started getting more of the jobs that SAG apparently feels its members are entitled to.
The conceit of claiming that they are responsible for “95% of the earnings in primetime television” is beyond ludicrous.
Hitch was right; these people are cattle.
Screw SAG. The writers wreaked havoc on Los Angeles last year and caused so many to lose their jobs and homes, now the actors would do the same.
SAG members, you should be ashamed of yourselves. Wake up – media is changing. The old system is nearly dead, and your union fat cats merely take your money and shield you from having to compete like the rest of us do.
Meanwhile, good luck getting tips waiting tables in the economy you’ll create here if you strike.
The success of a strike threat may be directly proportional to stock market conditions.
Media companies are currently under enormous financial stress because their share prices are in the tank. A strike at this moment in time would be devastating.
If the market goes up, SAG’s leverage decreases.
But if the market continues to stagnate, SAG may be able to take advantage of a unique opportunity, one that did not exist when the other guilds negotiated their contracts.
While I understand the distress a WGA or Sag strike can cause to individual crew members, especially now, it’s crucial for you guys to respect each unions’ judgement about how to negotiate and whether to strike or not. Until we can get the abolition of sympathy strikes out of our contracts, all the unions are compromised and weak. To have IATSE members griping about the SAG prima donnas is exactly what the AMPTP wants to encourage. So, how about a little support for your fellow union members? Believe me, in 3 years, after they are done screwing the actors, IATSE will be next.
Enough already SAG.
Send out the ballots, authorize the strike, call a strike and then march, picket, hold a rally, chant, cheer, get your picture in the news, show your “POWER”, show your “PRIDE” and then, after 6 long weeks, tell us how much your poor feet hurt and ……
sign the SAME deal that every other union in this town signed.
Good luck in three years.
Oh yeah, during your strike, watch the studios force the writers to cross your picket lines by keeping shows in production rather than going on hiatus.
This will be great drama and even better comedy!
What does today being Thanksgiving have to do with anything? It’s a Thursday, and there was news available. It was posted.
I’ve stated this before, but… If the AMPTP gets even one of it’s ridiculous demands of SAG, they win; if they get none of those concessions from SAG (and this is the important part), they don’t lose.
Either way, they don’t lose.
But a SAG strike? – they lose big time, which is why they won’t allow it to happen. They know very well that they’re pushing for concessions that aren’t going to happen, and they’ll keep acting like it’s possible until the SAG membership rears it’s collective head with a resounding “no more of this bullshit!” The AMPTP can only play this bluff/brinkmanship until they’re faced with a SAG strike authorization. Then, no more BS.
I think it’s also important to note the AMPTP’s implicit threat about their ‘offer’ perhaps not being so ‘generous’ if/after SAG strikes – as if they’ll rescind some of that offer and it won’t be ‘as good’. I hope the SAG NegCom takes this into consideration and throws it right back in their face. If management doesn’t deal fairly with us from here on out, I hope that SAG pulls back all or at least most of the concessions we have offered. If we have to strike to get a deal, then our current offer should be off the table as well. (For instance, I want .55/mile for gas allowance back out on the table.) If they force us to strike, I want to take our very first contract offer and stick it right up their greedy asses.
Yeah, I know that sounds ‘militant’ but I’m not ranting here. I hate being pushed around by wealthy and powerful people, and we all need to put a stop to it. I’m tired of their threats (both implicit and explicit), I’m tired of their lies, spin, shills and overall negative campaigns against SAG. I know absolutely where the line has been drawn and I won’t back off of it any further. A labor action is our only weapon, and if I ever thought that SAG was using that threat unfairly I would be vociferous in my disdain for it. But that ain’t what’s happening.
It’s time for the powerful SAG membership to stand up, to stand together and say “no more!”
In solidarity -
The bottom line here is that the deal ALL the other guilds took was sucky too. Thanx DGA! (Yeah, U caved first.) But let’s look at facts: the producers are megacorps who can take ANOTHER strike – we’ll all be watching crapass reality and acquired pix more. And of course George and Will and Brad and their ilk will somehow keep working anyway. It’ll be the middle-class actors screwed again, along with the all the others who are supported by this industry. And just WHAT is SAG expecting to get that is better than the others?
If the contract is for 3 years would they not be in a better position in 3 years time to have seen how “new media” has impacted the industry and could fight for residuals then. I’m all for fighting for your rights but if you do not know at this stage how greatly “new media” will effect things then I think they are premature with their strike threat. It’s not like this new contract is set in stone for life.
It’s also obvious to anyone not in the industry that award season is where it will hit them the most thus this is when they will no doubt strike but since SAG Awards is on TNT it wont be affected in the slightest – surprise surprise. The Golden Globes were allowed to be the main casualty this year as it is used more to network than being an Awards show to respect so no doubt the same will happen next year and everything will be settled at the last minute to allow the Academy Awards to go ahead – SAG you lot are so predictable please surprise me!
“The minimum residual for a TV show rerun on the Internet for six months is over $600 for a director or a writer, but only $22.77 for an actor who works as a day player.”
Should a day player really be making as much as a director or writer in residuals? Keep buttering the nuts of those day players — They’ll need good morale when they’re sleeping in their cars.
1. phasing out of residuals
2. loss of clip consent
3. product placement
4. force majeure
Those are the biggies. It’s an un-signable contract. Any hope of the producers coming back to the table to renegotiate in three years is naive. Precedent shows that. VHS/DVD. Cable residuals, 22 and 20 years old, respectively. Horrible deals, promises of renegotiation. Never happened. Once they establish a business model for new media with nonunion talent, and phase out residuals through new media language in this contract, there’s no going back. Be wise. Research the issues. Listen to your leadership. And remember: the producers ARE our adversaries – that’s the way it is at the negotiating table. They want us cheap, AFTRA gives it to them. SAG stands up for its members. The blame for the fall-out on the town from a strike needs to be placed at the foot of those responsible – the AMPTP.
From “Awaiting the Drama”:
Oh yeah, during your strike, watch the studios force the writers to cross your picket lines by keeping shows in production rather than going on hiatus.”
You’re right. The same shows will keep on shooting, and the writers will cross picket lines to write compelling plot lines for the set pieces, since every SAG actor will be absent.
“Next, on House. House’s desk chair looks angrily at the stationary cane next to the wall, while Cuddy’s lamp turns off and on, flirtatiously. Don’t miss this very special episode.”
Hell! It’ll be great! They won’t even have to cut to commercial. While shooting the static set pieces, they’ll just insert pieces of product all over the set. And think of the production costs saved when they can just take a still photo of the set, and show that for an hour. Genius!
Wow, WTD. The same shows will still be in production during the strike? Didn’t know that. But since according to you that’s the case, why the hell do you care if we strike or not?
whats good for the writers & directors isn’t good enough for you?? Are you kidding me? You want MORE people out of work and not working during the holiday season and the biggest economic depression in years so you actors are guaranteed more money than the people that actually write the material that you “portray”?
selfishness and ignorance… i wasnt a fan of writers when they pushed the amptp but at least they knew when enough was enough
take it while you can
The AMPTP’s claim that SAG is being offered the same deal as other unions is an absurd. It would be a better world if people would choose to think rather than believe those with more money who run corporations are somehow better and smarter than themselves.
While there may be similarities in the current UNION contracts and the contract offered to SAG, the fact that the different UNIONS perform very different services makes it impossible to do a line by line comparison across the board and see anything but very, very different contracts.
SAG needs a contract that works for SAG MEMBERS. Any spin the AMPTP runs to try to make the public believe anything else like one contract will work for all UNIONS is a smoke screen to cover up the issue that they are screwing UNION members.
Those who are in a UNION, who have an understanding of the fight the UNIONS are and have always been in, and who have a ounce of self worth know the AMPTP is lying. They also know the AMPTP needs to be accountable for their unwillingness to bargain. And those who understand will be right next to SAG members if we are forced to strike. Because they understand our fight is their fight and we are all in this together.
For all those who are whining about how SAG will ruin your life by striking: look at the history of the American worker before UNIONS fought for your 40 work week, your decent wage, your overtime pay, your health benefits, and host of other compensation you seem to take for granted. And don’t think management wouldn’t roll them all back for you in an instant if we didn’t use collective bargaining to force them to treat us all fairly.
The real enemy here is the AMPTP. If you want to protect what is yours you need to start thinking about it as ours. Because while your tantrum on a message board may make you feel good, it will be a poor bargaining tool against the mammoth AMPTP if one day you are forced to negotiate by your lonesome.
Thankfully most of the industry understands this and you will see us all together on the picket lines– but only if the AMPTP forces us to STRIKE.
Dear “Someone That Actually Thinks”,
You wrote “whats good for the writers & directors isn’t good enough for you?”
And the answer is… no. It’s not “good enough” for actors because we get paid differently than writers and directors. But you must have missed that fact in your endeavor to blame SAG for the industry’s problems, like so many others. You say you think, but apparently you can’t read.
And also apparently, you aren’t a member of any of the industry guilds because if you were, you wouldn’t be spouting “take it while you can”. Unions know better.
(And by the way, you should be “Someone Who Thinks”, not “That Thinks”. Think about that.)
One more thing: a strike, if it happens, wouldn’t happen until the holidays are over. But I wouldn’t be buying any new cars for Christmas if I were you…
Alec Delta–
wow are you bananas. Without actors, there would be no business. None. We are the beginning (remember, this shit started around a fire in the desolate nowhere with storytelling) and it can’t be at our expense that the business reformats itself. This contract, as T-Rex so succinctly put it, is unsignable. It is absolutely unsignable. We cannot allow non-union work under our contract. No way. We cannot allow the cut in residuals as the format changes and the distribution model is forever morphed onto th net. We cannot.
And for ‘Someone That Actually Thinks’– to think the deal is the same for us makes your moniker an absurdity. We don’t have the same structural income as the other guilds. We just don’t. For you to also put quotes around the word portray is just a sad, sniping attack on a good, honest profession that has been the main concern of my life as art and now commerce.
Please don’t mock me when offering me and my brethren advice. We aren’t guaranteed more money. Hell, we’ve offered every sort of damn concession possible. They won’t negotiate with us. So it’s time to authorize the use of nuclear weapons. Not saying we’ll launch them but we have to have a resolution to this round.
You don’t understand either the contract nor the nature of how we earn a living (most of us barely survive, btw). Bone up on that and we’ll have a conversation.
The ignorance, it seems, is plural and ubiquitous.
Alec Eiffel
There is just one problem Sterling, do you think that the moguls will stand for writers writing while actors are on strike. Last I checked, writers need actors to help them do their work for them. This means that WGA writers will be laid off if there is an SAG strike. Advertisers will not stand for writing for set pieces. All that will happen is that they will force the AMPTP to make a deal with SAG and that will only happen if the board gets the right to authorize a strike and set a strike deadline.
This is what is happening right now.
1. The AMPTP is scared shit that SAG wants its membership to vote to give the board the right to authorize a strike. That is why there are people here posing as BTL’s telling members to oppose a strike authorization.
2. If Tom Hanks stands to lose rights to residues from movies he already made, in rollback form, there is no reason not to strike, and you can bet that Tom will be there supporting the strike authorization vote. Heck, he might even tell David Letterman that negotiators should be stuck in the back room at the Hello Deli and not come out until there is a deal.
3. When the strike authorization vote passes, there will be renewed urgency by the AMPTP to reach a fair deal with SAG. That will happen with shareholders and the stock market forcing the AMPTP companies go back into negotiations.
4. If negotiations break down, or the AMPTP refuses to budge despite concern raised by shareholders and the stock market, SAG will be forced to set a strike deadline.
5. Once SAG has set a strike deadline, we will likely see a countdown to the strike much like the one that preceded the August 12, 1994 Baseball strike. The only difference is that actors are fighting for their jobs, and rights to payments that they deserve and won in previous negotiations as well as a better foothold into new media. What SAG is asking for represents only 1-3% of total cost. Those gains are insignificant compared what a second strike in two years would cost. Also, the insurance companies will likely pull their protection of all TV production involving actors except for same day tapes of late night talk shows and award shows such as the Oscars.
6. By this time SAG’s strike deadline has passed. By this time the AMPTP would hope that the actors don’t have the balls to actually strike and SAG will continue to push back the strike deadline so that pilot season is saved. However, they will be wrong and there will be pickets everywhere and you can bet your booties that GE (NBCU), CBS, Viacom, Time Warner, Disney, Sony, and News Corp. will be shorted to the point that one or all of the companies will be swallowed up by the likes of Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, Apple, or worse, Mark Cuban (from management’s perspective).
7. Let’s say that the first day of the SAG strike is Tuesday February 24th meaning that the strike deadline is 11:59 PM Eastern time Monday February 23rd. The first day of the strike could be an embarrassing (to the moguls at least) SAG/WGA rally at Television City in protest of American Idol and Simon’s treatment of writers. If that happens, we are in for at least a two month strike or longer where public perception is that Hollywood moguls treat both actors and writers like yesterday’s trash. With that, the only networks that have the resources to weather the 2009 Actors strike are CBS and Disney. First off, Disney can air College Basketball on both ABC and ESPN with nightly games on ABC to sub for lost programming, and they can air as much of the D1 Women’s NCAA Tournament as possible while CBS’s coverage of the men’s tournament sees the first and second rounds stretched out to eight days of coverage from day into night with the Third Round on a weekend and the Quarterfinals taking place in one day starting at 12 noon Eastern and all games beyond the four day 1st round being nationally televised (The first and second rounds are usually played out over a two day period).
8. It is now April and the SAG strike has lasted about 5 weeks. At this time, the stock market has plunged to depths not seen since the mid 1990’s. At this time, the only thing that can get a deal done is if Microsoft takes over NBC Universal, or SAG forces a deal that is 400 times better than the one they are asking for right now, and it includes back pay on all home video residues since 1986.
Postscript: The AMPTP knows that SAG doesn’t want to strike, but when the going gets tough, the tough get going. In this case, it is not what the AMPTP wants, it is what they get. In these bad economic times, it is right and proper for SAG to strike because it means that there will be a quicker deal, and a strike is going to be the tool that breaks the AMPTP’s back. Yes the AMPTP is there to break the back of unions, but Nick Counter and company have had it great for far too long and it is time for them to get a taste of their own medicine in the form of failing companies and falling stock prices. Nobody wants a strike, but when you actors get the strike authorization ballot in the mail, I hope you vote yes and mail it out as soon as possible. That is the only way that truants like Nick Counter will listen.
God knows I don’t want to see my show THE UNIT go off the air for another strike, after I and many others fought long and hard to bring it back after the last strike.
But I’ll be damned if I won’t stand up and support every single SAG member on it who strikes to get a new and better contract. They and every other SAG member deserve it.
Jesse S, T-rex, Zackery-
You guys always are the only ones posting on here. Don’t you work? Ive shot 2 features since you’ve started your bitching.
Jess s. you seem to have an inside knowledge of what will happen. Are you and actor? Why are you shy about posting under your name? I’d like to know your background to adequately judge your opinions.
huh???
2 features?! Really?! I can’t wait! I’m sure you are fantastic as “the guy who walks through the scene with newspaper under his arm.”
Tell us all which features so we can take a break from bitching and look out for you. I hear you’re great.
You’ll have to forgive my son. He absolutely refuses to take his olanzapine. It all started when he brought imaginary friends through middle school to high school and all the way into college before he dropped out. We were hoping it was a passing phase. We were sadly mistaken.
Please don’t correct him on the two features he claims to have recently worked. We used to try, when he would come out of his bedroom in our house with his computer camera and say, “Mommie! I just shot another feature!” but we found the process draining. And in the end, he’d just work harder to defend his fantasy as well as becoming a bit uncontrollable.
You obviously know that’s why he didn’t name the features he worked on, even though he’s anonymous.
It’s a shame when he tries to build himself up with fantasies by putting others down. But that’s a small price to pay for our little boy just 31 years young so that we can avoid committing him. Again.
Rex:
Maybe I’m just naive, but I’ve been really reluctant to believe that a significant portion of the union bashing has been coming from AMPTP shills. But I gotta tell you, with each passing day, my beliefs that there isn’t a significant percentage of “fake” posts — mouthing AMPTP talk points with absolutely no rational discussion whatsoever much like AMPTP itself — is diminishing.
I think “huh???” is case in point.
How many features, even if we’re being generous, have shot in L.A. in the last couple of months. 12? I can personally only name about 4, or maybe 5-6 if I really rack my brain on point.
So, what? Our bud there has shot even a single day-player on 2 = 20%?!?! or so of them? And refuses to name them even though he posts anonymously? And the posts primary reason for existence is to bash the peops with sound arguments in support of a “yes” to strike authorization vote? Sounds more than slightly suspicious to me.
Maybe I’m “last to the party” in doubting lots of these anonymous posts are by the people they pretend to be … but I gotta tell you, I’m no longer so sure.
best,
sterling
(dear huh??? If you’d like to bash -me- for not working as much as you pretend to be, be my guest. But for two studio films I did -last- year I’d be royally fucked right now given the dearth of feature films being shot this year: 1) Blink and miss me for Mr. eastwood; 2) Doing the voices of the creatures for “I Am Legend.” When I demanded screen credit in negotiations, WB told my agent to stick it up my ass because they’d rather just hire somebody else rather than voluntarily give over 50 SAG members screen credit if I were to balk. Gee, I guess being part of the voices 80% of the time the “Legend” creatures were on screen on the $600 million earner was just too f’ing insignificant a contribution to deserve credit, as opposed to credits such as “the assistant of the assistant of the assistant of Mr. Will Smith.”
Huh???, but for my deferred compensation, i.e., residuals for those two films shot -last- year, I’d be fucked. And if you were real, you’d know that its these residuals where SAG must draw the line in the sand, especially given that in addition to TV “scale +10% or go away” offers have become the norm, more studios are playing the same hard line with -all- non-name talent.
You worked two features recently? In other words, you worked the equivalent in whatever city you purport to be on at least 20% of features currently shot there? Good for you! You’re anonymous. -Name ‘em-. Otherwise, yours is simply one more in a long line of posts that are turning anti-conspiracy-theorist peops like me into skeptics).
Alec Delta, I love how you play your patsy line about actors being “waiters”. Yet:
1. You need a new line. That one’s clearly gone stale.
2. A lot of working actors HAVE to wait tables because they can’t earn a living as an actor. They hold down two full time jobs, and they do it because they love it – meanwhile you have have about as much passion as a bucket of sebum, and would rather back down from a stand that needs to be had… aka, this one.
3. I am sure there’s a lot of stars that you patronize in the theaters and on TV that were once waiters. I’d love to see you break that insult out in front of them… but you wouldn’t because the gorge between your legs has let your dignity seep out. I can smell the Skybar on you through the internet…
4. Yep, these waiters can read you like the trashy flyer you are, and they’re spitting in your food.
It really doesn’t matter if the poorly-reasoned and generally hateful pro-AMPTP posts come from paid shills, None of them that I’ve ever seen during this potential strike or the WGA’s real strike has EVER presented so much as a weak argument to support the idea that what the unions are demanding from the AMPTP isn’t fair or just.
The arguments (likely some from shills and some from people posting their frothing anger for free) are always of the you-can’t-win variety or the I-don’t-care-what’s-fair-for-YOU-I-want-(fill in this blank here with: TO MAKE MONEY FOR MYSELF, TO WATCH MY FAVORITE TV SHOW, etc.) In other words, these pro-AMPTP/anti-union posters are saying they don’t care about anybody’s needs but their own.
If their needs are those of the posters who call themselves fans, then they really can’t be expected to understand what’s going on. If they’re people who think their income, their future, their security, etc. is more important than the strikers’, the strikers’ attitude should be “f*uck them!”
I don’t recall SAG or the WGA telling IATSE members to accept a lousy deal (Tom Short did so without any prodding, but that’s a different story). Why would anybody listen to these how-dare-you-fight-for- what’s-right-when-it-could-hurt ME! posters.
It doesn’t matter if they are who they say they are, paid shills or freelance assholes. If they have no really argument for why SAG should take what the AMPTP offered (and they DON’T. The fact that other unions folded and took crappy deals is not a reason why anybody else SHOULD do the same), why even acknowledge these posters?
They contribute nothing to the discussion but noise.
“In other words, these pro-AMPTP/anti-union posters are saying they don’t care about anybody’s needs but their own”
See that’s kind of how I and many others feel about SAG. It’s not that I support the AMPTP or even agree with them, but from where I stand it seems incredibly selfish and greedy to once again grind the entertainment industry to a halt for the potential to get marginally better terms than every other union has received in the past year. There are so many people out there that rely on the entertainment industry (an industry that still hasn’t recovered from the WGA strike) for their livelihoods that a strike would put in danger of becoming unemployed or suffering further economic setbacks in an already difficult economic climate. These people could lose everything and stand to gain nothing from a SAG strike, yet SAG members/supporters have the gall to accuse THEM of selfishness? I understand the frustration of SAG members, but the new contract is slightly better than the last one and now is simply not the time to be striking. It might sound selfish, but it is no less selfish than a small group of people like SAG willing to put everyone else in the entertainment industry’s employment at risk for what will most likely be minimal gains.
Also to those who think that a SAG strike will lead to markedly better terms, if the WGA strike and most recent labor disputes that have led to strikes (see the recent Boeing strikes) have taught us is that striking does not usually result in a much better deal. You can believe that SAG won’t accept a lousy deal like the WGA did, but when push comes to shove, the SAG leaders will cave, the AMPTP will throw them a bone so they have something to show for their union and SAG will claim victory. Meanwhile, they will cost the entertainment industry (not just producers) billions of dollars and further cripple it.
I personally think that SAG and WGA are actually right, but the AMPTP is not going to give them what they want and SAG isn’t going to change anything. They should just save us all the trouble by accepting the reality of the situation, giving up on getting all of their demands met, and focusing on getting those that they can. Despite what SAG leadership might say, this can all be done without a strike if they would just realize what they can and can’t get out of the AMPTP and move on and spare us all the pain of another prolonged work stoppage.
to “writer”
you said… “If they’re people who think their income, their future, their security, etc. is more important than the strikers’, the strikers’ attitude should be “f*uck them!””
Wow. What is wrong with you?
people are expressing that a strike is putting their income and livelihood in jepaordy. That is a fact. If a union decides to strike to benifit themselves, they will hurt others in the process. That doesn’t mean a union shouldn’t strike but it’s a responsibility that is very real and that they must weigh and respect. Your response to those people is “f*uck them!”
What could be more selfish?
The only noise here is coming from you and it’s very very ugly and depressing.
It’s really too bad that, given this forum and opportunity to discuss this very grave and far-reaching issue and impending decision, so many go to the same boring, defensive, unproductive and bigoted places.
“You must be a shill if you disagree with me!”
“Screw you! We have a right to this!”
“What movies have YOU been in, loser?”
In reference to Jessy S Para 7 –
Re the timing of the strike example date 24 Feb – do you honestly think they will wait until a few days after award season to start their strike???. If they had wanted to settle they would have done so already – award season is when they get maximum leverage and it hurts the big wigs the most so if there is any hint of an actual strike it will kick in just in time to scupper the Golden Globes on the weekend 10/11 Jan.
I am not sure about time scales and how long it would take but I did read some weeks ago if strike authorisations were sent out end of Nov it would be early Jan before they could call a strike and it appears this is what is happening. SAG have nothing to lose as their own award show is on TNT and will not be affected by any of this. I would actually respect SAG if none of this ends up interfering with the award season and they are indeed as they say using the threat of a strike to get them back to the bargaining table and will use a strike as a last resort – months down the line and after the Academy Awards have taken place – I just somehow doubt this will happen. As I said previously it was obvious from various sources that the Globes are thought of as a big joke and not exactly prestigious so they were allowed to be the big scape goat of this year and me thinks they’ll get screwed next year too.
“re: writer” wrote, “See that’s kind of how I and many others feel about SAG. It’s not that I support the AMPTP or even agree with them, but from where I stand it seems incredibly selfish and greedy to once again grind the entertainment industry to a halt for the potential to get marginally better terms than every other union has received in the past year.”
Sounds more like you do support the AMPTP, don’t support SAG and don’t support the WGA who you blame for the last work stoppage. And it seems you want to feel good about yourself for that.
As eloquent as your response is it only reiterates what “writer” is saying. And phrases like “marginally better” illustrate your lack of understanding of the issues, not the least of which amount to huge rollbacks in the money actors will earn.
No one wants a work stoppage and no one wants a strike. And you may be right with logic that’s like telling your child not to fight back against the schoolyard bully who is taking his lunch money– even though you don’t support bullies– because it will make the world a better, nicer, friendlier, altruistic place. But it seems with an understanding of the bigger picture you could see whether it’s the AMPTP or the schoolyard bully you don’t support, your method will leave your child forever hungry.
“selfish and greedy” are not right. But to pin those terms on the one trying to protect his or her own lunch money can’t convince you that you don’t support bullies, can it? With each battle you let them win, bullies only get more comfortable doing what they do. Even if it’s not specifically to you just yet.
Paul: you make a thoughtful argument. I think that you can’t tell people not to defend themselves. But the problem with your analogy is it breaks down very quickly. If the kid punches the bully in the nose, nobody else gets hurt. That is not the case here. Also telling your kid not to go and punch a bully in the nose isn’t to make the world a better, nicer, altruistic place. It’s because you don’t want to raise your kid to solve every problem by hitting someone, even if that’s how the bully does it. Because your child will grow up with a wider range of choices than just, hit the guy or don’t hit the guy and get robbed. Just as those who say there is not much to gain in this strike are over-simplifying, this is over-simplification as well.
I am a SAG member. I want a better deal. I don’t like what they’re offering. But I am not one single kid on a idyllic schoolyard who needs only to hit this one bully to get my money back. It is a messy and diffictult time for many people and I find it impossible to ignore the conseqences my actions (a strike) would inflict upon other people. To weigh that against what we have to gain by stopping work for everyone is a crucial and difficult equation to figure and the stakes are high for an enormous ammount of people. It’s my personal view that, even if the strike may be right for us, that doesn’t make it right.
I am pursuadable and I’m listening but so far, I personally don’t want this to happen.
“Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.” Martin Luther King Jr.
Well, sag member, it’s consequences now, or consequences later. Those massive rollbacks to actor’s incomes has an economic effect that goes beyond the actor himself. Indeed, with what AMPTP wants, it would make it impossible to make a living as an actor, now, and anyone acting in the future, except for a very privileged few at the very top(even more so than it is now). These guys are bullies, they created this situation from beginning to end. SAG hasn’t had their finest hour either, but, we’re backed into a corner. AMPTP has even reneged on the WGA deal. They don’t give a fuck. They will let a strike happen because their pockets are deeper than ours, and they can just go make reality TV. Honestly, as far as SAG goes, we needed a Jimmy Hoffa, etc, negotiating for us. What we got was the cast of spongebob squarepants(no offense to the cast of spongebob squarepants). These fools aren’t serious competition, and AMPTP knows that.
sag member
Go to the post about the IATSE “deal” and see what those guys are saying. There’s a lot of anti-strike rhetoric, until people read the fine print, as IATSE members are now doing. You won’t find much support from them for their deal either.
The AMPTP is beginning to freak out. Seen their latest letter? They were right on the edge of wrapping everybody up in this new media deal, and now SAG is really throwing a wrench in their plans, and man oh man, they are pissed.
People seem to forget that before they made any deals, they put their true thoughts about abolishing residuals in writing:
The New York Times
July 11, 2007
Hollywood Executives Call for End to Residual Payments
By MICHAEL CIEPLY
ENCINO, Calif., July 11 — In an unusually blunt session here today, several of Hollywood’s highest-ranking executives called for the end of the entertainment industry’s decades-old system of paying what are called residuals to writers, actors and directors for the re-use of movie and television programs after their initial showings.
The executives stopped short of saying they would demand an immediate end to residual payments in the upcoming, probably difficult negotiations with writers, actors and directors. But they were emphatic in calling for the dismantling of a system under which specific payments are made when movies and shows are released on DVD, shown abroad or otherwise resold. Instead, they want to pool such revenue and recover their costs before sharing any of the profit with the talent.
“There are no ancillary markets any more; it’s all one market,” said Barry Meyer, chief executive of Warner Brothers. “This is the time to do it.”
The briefing at the headquarters of the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers, an industry bargaining group, was conducted by Mr. Meyer, Leslie Moonves, chief executive of CBS, and Anne Sweeney, president of the Walt Disney-ABC Television Group, along with the alliance’s president, J. Nicholas Counter. It was intended to set the stage for Monday’s opening of contract talks with the Writers Guild of America unions on both coasts.
A spokesman for the Writers Guild of America West had no immediate response. But representatives of that guild and other unions said they expect to extend their compensation arrangements to new media rather than retreating from existing formulas.
The industry’s contract with the writers expires on Oct. 31, while contracts with the Screen Actors Guild and the Writers Guild of America the following June 30. With these deadlines looming, networks and studios have been scrambling to lock up additional episodes of shows that could be aired in the event of a strike, and movies that could be finished before the actors’ deadline. The industry executives declined to discuss specific contract proposals. But they said they would adamantly oppose any move to extend residual-like payments to the sale of movies and shows on the Web or in other new media. They repeated an earlier call for a study that would, in effect, defer decisions about such distribution channels for as long as three years.
“We need complete flexibility,” said Ms. Sweeney, who described broadcasters as being in a desperate scramble for revenue as consumers increasingly turn to online sources for programs that are often stripped of advertising. “Guild restraints limit our ability to do what we need to do,” she said.
T-Rex quotes fromt he NY Times, “In an unusually blunt session here today, several of Hollywood’s highest-ranking executives called for the end of the entertainment industry’s decades-old system of paying what are called residuals to writers, actors and directors for the re-use of movie and television programs after their initial showings.”
….and, scene.
Jessy, I’m not sure you understand why they are holding out – it’s not the money they lose from the concessions that they make NOW, it’s for the FUTURE PRECEDENTS that this sets. The more this year, the more you’ll expect next year, and so forth. It’s business, pure and simple.
Your assumptions and predictions of the machinations of major corporate conglomerants has the same ring of authority as one of the Baldwin brothers lecturing someone on sobriety.
Anonymous,
Of course you’re right: the more AMPTP gives now, the more people who create the product will expect later.
But the unions’ position is exactly the same: The more they allow themselves to get screwed today, the more the AMPTP will screw them tomorrow.
Your argument is the most concise one on this board for why SAG should strike and why everyone else (whether in another union or no union at all) should support that strike until the AMPTP actually negotiates in good faith.
Meanwhile, IATSE members are finally starting to see what rollbacks look like and to realize that the more the AMPTP gets to take from one group this time, the more they will take from all groups next time.