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(Photos, Lea Thompson and Sally Kirkland rally while Carlos Granda of ABC News reports; SAG president Alan Rosenberg with actress and former SAG VP Anne Marie Johnson; Keith Carradine speaking at rally; SAG's exec director Doug Allen; and board member Justine Bateman. All except Carradine photo by Jim Stevenson.)
LAPD unofficially estimated the SAG Solidarity Rally crowd at 550. SAG leaders Rosenberg and Doug Allen gave impassioned speeches explaining that they want to negotiate a fair deal for actors and a cohesive pay grid on New Media. Rosenberg began his remarks by reminding the rally that 75 years ago at the height of the depression the studios instituted a 50% pay cut for actors, and the actors responded by founding the Screen Actors Guild on June 30, 1933 — almost exactly 75 years ago. Also taking the podium was actor Keith Carradine. In the crowd could be seen former SAG prez Ed Asner, David Arquette, William Mapother, Joe Bologna, Renee Taylor, Justine Bateman, David Clennon, Scott Wilson, Lisa Ann Walter, Kate Flannery, Willie Garson, Joely Fisher, David Marciano, Erica Gimpel, Michael Dorn, Marg Helgenberger and more. WGA leaders Patrick Verrone and Dave Young also spoke and urged SAG to improve upon the writers' terms and "move the ball down the field." Other WGA members spotted were Joss Whedon, Dianne Burroughs, Joey Gutteriez, Alan Sereboff, Jill Kushner. 
As expected, the subject of the AFTRA-AMPTP deal came up. Hundreds of assembled SAG/AFTRA dual-card holders chanted "Vote no! Vote no!" when the subject of the current AFTRA contract proposal came up. One of their signs read, "Vote no on AFTRA's 'give away' contract! Send them back to get a better one!" As one SAG board member attending told me. "They understood that a 'yes' vote on that proposal would have us agreeing to sub-par conditions considering what SAG can potentially achieve for us. Really, I think you can better rates by standing out in front of Home Depot."
Some members of the SAG negotiating committee from regional branches said they wouldn't attend the rally in Los Angeles because they saw it as an action to "thwart" the ratification of the AFTRA contract vote. There has been a huge schism between SAG NY vs LA for months now. NY division president Sam Freed said in a statement: "This is one of a series of miscalculations by Membership First that jeopardizes our negotiations and the interests of the membership. There is absolutely no evidence that this effort to defeat the AFTRA contract will help us. It will only serve to create more uncertainty in a community that is desperate to get back to work. It is an irresponsible embarrassment." Negotiating committee co-chair Mike Pniewski echoed: "We cannot support anything which jeopardizes our negotiations at this very sensitive time and that is just what this ill advised action does. There's simply too much at stake to engage in such a divisive initiative."
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How many paid SAG staffers are in the picture?
Ah, it is as I thought. No working actors to be seen.
Man, in this economy… I hate to see another strike authorized. There will be blood on the streets. Both SAG AND the AMPTP.
no matter how principled the issues…a strike in this economy, like a previous poster said, will do MAJOR damage to an already struggling industry. some families/businesses are just beginning to recover from the wga strike, what’s the cost of living out a che guevarra/cesar chavez fantasy?….
but hey, some of these people will get cool photo-ops though
I personally saw lots of SAG staffers coming down in the elevators, putting on their T-Shirts and grabbing up their signs. Maybe Doug should give ‘em background pay. Oops, I forgot, Sag only covers the first ten. “Come back with your picket sign or on it!”
By the way, thanks AFTRA, we’re with you. Great job.
Better rates at home depot. God such rhetoric. Ask those people outside of home depot if they want to trade places.
I was working today and there were a lot of extras there. None said they would vote for any kind of strike, they just want it to be over. In fact they think in very end they will get thrown under the bus.
I can’t see this ending well for SAG. The AMPTP is in a position of strength, and with AFTRA and factions within SAG doing the dividing, all AMPTP has to do is wait and conquer.
They might have to eat a bad deal this year, but start preparing to fight for the next contract right from a position of unified strength from day one.
With friends like the Allens, we’ll all end up at Home Depot. Looking for jobs.
I don’t need SAG, or anyone else for that matter, telling me to vote against the AFTRA contract. It’s a TERRIBLE deal.
Yeah, like WGA negotiator said, “move the ball down field.” Instead of losing yards on a disastrous lateral from the traiterous DGA insterad.
550? That’s the highest estimate I’ve heard yet. And I saw the footage on the news…no WAY 550. And based on the color of the t-shirts, of the total 150 I was given, it’s estimated about 75 were SAG & WGA staff.
And then half the Negotiating Committee boycotted the event in protest over this foolhardy AFTRA-bashing strategy.
More Politics of Destruction…..pathetic.
As to how many actors were at the rally, I’d say 550 was a conservative estimate. Every square inch of the courtyard at 5757 was occupied with union members.
The sag staff(no more than 10)was clearly identified so as not to be mixed up with the union membership.
The signs and t-shirt you saw them carrying were to hand out to members. The t-shirt they handed out were different than the ones that said “SAG STAFF” that they were wearing They were there to help with the crowd with water and parking validation.
If the video look like less people it was because the video was taken AFTER the rally. Do you get it!!!
To the guy on the elevator; Admit you work for AFTRA and you were coming down from the 9th floor!
The dishonesty of the AFTRA leadership AND staff is legendary. The previous biased posts are a great examples.
I was there, what I posted is the truth.
Sheesh.
wow…solidarity…huh….if these are the best numbers you can rally together when you have over 100,000 members….i’m just sayin.
I am so furious with AFTRA right now. And I’ve been a dues paying member for 20 + years now. AFTRA is cutting seperate deals WITH EVERY SINGLE SHOW. Not just a standard contract that we all vote on, but seperate deals. I just found out that the AFTRA pilot I finished didn’t pay double time after 12 hours. When did this happen? When did the dues paying membership vote on this? How can this even be allowed? On average I worked a 13-14 hour day. And believe me I am grateful for it, but who is making these deals ? These shows are termed AFTRA, but with “SAG rates and conditions”. Well the meal penalties were different amounts ( 25 on the front end, 35 on the back end good if you only have 1 or 2, not so good when you have 5 or 6 which we had ) and NO DOUBLE TIME. Hardly “SAG rates and conditions”.
Where is the ALF-CIO in all of this and can dual card holders bring a class action lawsuit against AFTRA? These pilots were probably going AFTRA anyway, in fear of a strike and I understand that, but to further undercut the AGREED UPON rates and call it SAG rates and conditions is a bald faced lie. I don’t trust them and I’m voting NO as a sign of disgust.
Also AFTRA can’t even manage to hand out the check authorizations forms to all the non-union and AFTRA”WILLING” members working side by side with me. They get their checks sent to them directly as do I. And cash them with no repercussions. Apparently they are “AFTRA willing “. The only difference is that I PAID MY DUES. !!!! This union makes a fool of me for doing so.
A recent casting breakdown on L.A. Casting invited AFTRA members, AFTRA willing and non-union.
So ………..anyone ??????????????
You there, on the corner, you look like a professional.
Have you ever seen a SAG breakdown like that? No, and you never will.
I’ll admit, that SAG has made some serious errors in these negotiations, first by setting such a contentious tone with AFTRA when we needed the solidarity, and by waiting to long to negotiate with the AMPTP. Like it or not, SAG is the actor here and when the actor gets an “audition” or meeting with a studio you don’t say, “let me get back to you in a month or so”. You go and do your best.
But all in all SAG’s heart is in the right place. I can’t say that of AFTRA or the AMPTP.
Peggy Lane O’Rourke
As I posted yesterday, but it was not printed – here’s where the rubber meets the road. I worked “Rescue Me,” an AFTRA contract, in a recurring role. My manager asked for 1500 per day for this top of show part. They said “1500 per day! That’s what we pay Charles Durning!” (Dennis Leary’s father on the show). Long story short – I ended getting 1500. That’s LESS than 1/3 of SAG top of show: salary, residuals, etc. There will NEVER be a “good” time to strike. NEVER. If we let this deal pass without a fair rate on a percentage of internet, an increased top of show rate (You USED to have a quote – remember “quotes?” – now, it’s “scale – take it or leave it,” so, at the very least, “scale” better be a damn site better than it is now). I currently have a series I was a regular on running – full episodes – on several web sites – for FREE! They run ads during the episode – so SOMEBODY is getting paid, but not me. I wasn’t even ASKED! If the AFTRA contract stands as is, as a precedent, SAG is done. I believe SAG is the most powerful union in the business BY FAR – but ONLY if we have the courage to threaten to STRIKE and to STRIKE if pushed to it. The “stars” who suck down 50% – sometimes more – of a TV show or movies’ budget? The “stars” who now also produce and direct and write? They need to put their SAG hats on, and understand that the AMPTP is trying to squeeze profit through an increasingly smaller window – us, the rank and file, because above the line costs (stars) are KILLING them. IF the stars remember where they came from, and put SAG first, and we ALL band together and let the AMPTP know we WILL strike and that it’s not an empty threat? How long do you think the AMPTP will wait to make a deal that gives SAG what it’s asking for now? Answer? NOT LONG. Without “stars” to make their movies and TV shows – they’re OUT OF BUSINESS FOLKS. So – Tom, George, Julia, Matt, Jack, Nicole, Brad, enjoy your 5,10,15,20 million dollar up front salaries and back end points, but understand – the rest of us can barely pay the bills. If we ALL band together? We can get this contract right. If we don’t? If we have the kind of “there’s no leverage, WGA just struck, whah, whah, whah,” crap I’m hearing and reading? We’re done. Mortgages WILL be fallen behind on, jobs WILL be lost. We WILL suffer. But – hey SAG members (especially dual SAG/ AFTRA people – like me) you want an actual BUSINESS in 5,10 years? You better get it right NOW, or the industry will put things just where they want them: “stars – and Wal-Mart workers.” Let’s all grow some onions, get this right, do what it takes (and WGA? you better be there WITH BELLS ON – NOT JUST ON DAY 5 OR 10, BUT DAY 75, OR DAY 100 – like we were for you)
Mrs. Wakely
SAG, AFTRA, AEA, DGA
Good luck, AMPTP. You survived the writer’s strike because you had scripts already in your hands. But when this actor’s strike comes, you’re left with nothing. No Iron Man 2. No Indiana Jones 5. Everything will be shut down and all SAG has to do is say, “we asked for a raise. Is that unreasonable? Would you work 30 years without a raise or take a paycut while your boss made billions?”
I was at the rally today. I don’t work for SAG. They work for me. And soon all our voices will be heard throughout this town. We have the power. You’ll see. You’ll hear. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
If you want the public sympathy on this, don’t show well known actors. It’s gonna work against you not for you.
Honestly, all this bickering back and forth is not helping anything. It’s really hurting you all.
If SAG could put this much energy into their negotiations they would actually be near a deal.
Pathetic. Paid staff used unethically. No stars. No working actors. One of the few times Alan Rosenberg gets to play the lead. Badly.
SAG: for God’s sake declare victory and move on and leave AFTRA alone before you become “the 2nd largest actors’ union.”
Doug Allen: You’ve got what you always wanted – you’ve made it all the way to the deadline and AFTRA’s not in the room….How’s it workin’ out for you, buddy?
It sucks to be SAG.
As noted above, no matter SAGs cause, the reality for a lot of actors is that the economy can’t support the strike.
Even worse is that, unlike the WGA, heavy hitters aren’t going to step up to the plate for them. The big names who could draw press (i.e. big name stars, who incidentally, don’t care one way another about SAG) aren’t going to do much…if anything, they’re going to knife SAG supporters who might disrupt filming for them.
I was there and 550 sounds about right. I was there as one of the WGA folks and I would guess there were about 75-100 WGA folks. Of WGA staff I would say I saw 10-20 (and that includes Patric and David).
The crowd fluctuated and I saw a lot of the news crews grabbing b roll at the beginning when not a lot of people were there yet.
Not that 550 is all that great a number or something to be crowing about, but I just had to give some real numbers after someone said 150 – that’s just obviously not from someone who was there.
P.S. I have no idea who was SAG staff and who was not.
Hey Leonides, what exactly was the “great job” AFTRA did? It’s great that they can count on such strong support from anonymous armchair snipers. But maybe they should know precisely what it was that pleased you so much.
AFTRA is a terrible union to work with regardless of the current SAG/AFTRA fragmentation. As an actor, it’s easy to tell that they’re blatantly on the producers side. AFTRA’s minimum yearly salary to obtain health insurance is MUCH higher than SAGs. Day/week rates are less. Their residual payments don’t kick in until a TV episodes airs for the 15th time (SAG pays out by the 2nd time). Who saves money by choosing AFTRA over SAG? The producers. With the economy in such terrible shape, AFTRA is clearly trying to snake SAG’s business.
I’m conflicted about this whole thing. I’m an actor trying to establish myself. It is extremely difficult to become a member of SAG. I did lots of background work when I made my way from the Inland Empire to Los Angeles. I never received a SAG Voucher for my background work.
3 SAG Vouchers of background work and one can join SAG. That is fantastic, except for the fact that its nearly impossible to achieve such a feat, although I know people that have accomplish such a task.
AFTRA on the other hand is incredibly easy to join. One can do background work and easily get an AFTRA voucher, yet don’t really need them…just the 1300 dollars to join…
I’ve worked on at least 3 SAG Indie films, you know the cool hip SAG contracted projects..yet..I don’t get a single voucher..even though I’m the lead in all the films..acting opposite James Russo..a background performer can get a voucher for lifting his hand to pretend he’s looking at his watch..
My point is that both acting unions need to work together and not fall into the AMPTP’s DIVIDE AND CONQUER Strategy. I think it is a given with regards to how things have been done in the past with the WGA..
..btw, I’m going to join AFTRA this week, cause otherwise I’m not considered a professional actor..
I could not make the rally due to personal commitments, and I’m sorry I missed out on the opportunity to personally thank our WGA brothers and sisters for turning out to support SAG. Please accept my gratitude from here.
The company I work for in Burbank laid off 5 people yesterday with the recent slowdown in pre-prod & production. this time it will be detrimental to our business.
Looking forward to Hollywood Strike 2: Electric Boogaloo – coming soon to a theater near you. Oh wait there won’t be actors
Agreed on the home depot comment being moronic. Unlike you bigshots, most of us peons in the world don’t work under any contract or for any union. We get paid based on what are talents are worth in the marketplace (what a novel concept).
Gee wiz, do you think the AMPTP is laughing now? We played right into their hands.
A strike at this juncture would be ridiculous and anyone who actually works knows that.
The fact that SAG and AFTRA leadership couldn’t figure out a way to work together during this negotiation is shameful. Who is to blame for that? I’ve got to put it on SAG. They are more powerful. And from what I’ve heard they treated the AFTRA leadership as an annoyance rather than an ally.
Militant leadership is not what we need. Prudent leadership is what we need. I can’t wait till we can vote to change the guard because this incendiary rhetoric aint helping anybody.
i am what many would call an A-list actor. Firstly, i wanted to be there at the rally yesterday for what is was publicized to be–a support rally for the sag negotiating team. It was never advertised as an anti-aftra rally, and honestly, having read the aftra deal, (i am a dual member) i feel the deal is so bad for working actors that i would never vote to ratify it. The offer from SAG to negotiate, in essence, for a better deal for all of us, in both unions, just seems smart, and possibly, a major gain for aftra members. why anyone would chose to see it any other way–as a divisive idea–is beyond me. For the record, i feel the stripping of actors rights to approve clips, and be paid a per use fee, is a HUGE deal. And i would be on the frontlines picketing if a strike is the only way to secure what has been ours for 50 years.
To the cowardly cynic who hides behind the name “Uh, Nikki”:
I know most of the men and women who staff the Screen Actors Guild.
Not one of them appears in the photos shown in this article.
Think about it: If you were an S.A.G. staff member, would you be STUPID enough to pose for a photo with actors, where you could be identified as a non-actor, and thus compromise the integrity of your union??
Answer: YOU might be stupid enough, but our staff is hired at a higher threshhold of intelligence.
When you enter your pro-AMPTP comments on this site, remember to fact-check and THINK first.
Dave Clennon
DOn’t act like a tough guy when you accept scraps as a meal. The Actors should get 20 times as much as they do and you fools think that 1 penny means something. They are nowhere without you. Hang tight. I can’t go throught this again in four years when they try to screw us again. Start negotiating side deals and put htem to pasture. WORK NOW. Lie the writers. grow the internet along with a pair of balls
If the WGA was serious at having leverage then, no matter how difficult it was to do, they should’ve found common cause with the DGA years before…after all the schedule of negotiations was no secret to anyone. But their egos got in the way and the AMPTP wisely took advantage of the situation. So the only recourse was the weakest one of all…to strike.
But that lack of wisdom pales in comparison to this; for SAG to not have found common cause with a union that represents the SAME PEOPLE, and to allow the AMPTP to again take advantage of the schism…this is laughable…this is consummate ego, pathological self-obsession. Word to SAG members: if your union can can’t come to agreement with another union repping the same people, how on earth do they have the skills to negotiate with the AMPTP?
I was there. But I didn’t need to go to a rally to know the AFTRA contract is lousy. I don’t need to be told to vote no on it. It’s not worthy of a professional and I would vote no on it even if SAG told me to vote yes. If it passes, I’m not working it. Why bother?
The SAG staffers had T-shirts on that said SAG STAFF. There were about 550 people there, I would guess, at the highest point. The crowd swelled and diminished, so it depended on if you were there at the beginning, middle or end. Plenty of working actors. Working actors are not all celebrities.
Lots of WGA. I don’t know how many. Thanks for coming, guys.
Oh and by the way, I don’t remember anyone official mentioning a strike. Sure, we need that solidarity so we can threaten a strike and mean it if we have to. But nobody wants it. Come on.
I’m just a writer, okay, so I’m not supposed to know about grownup stuff like budgets and net and rolling breaks. But what I can’t figure out — except if I’m writing about sharecropping or the Gilded Age or mill workers or child labor — is how come everybody in the film and TV industry seems to be earning a good living except the people who actually do the hard work and make the shows?
You may not see sag staff in the pictures here, but I saw at least a dozen in the NBC footage on the net, including Doug Allen’s executive assistant. Who knows how many on the B-roll.
What’s interesting is that those who pooh-pooh the numbers at the rally and cry that its only the unemployed who are at the rally and that working writers and actors weren’t there because they disagree with the leadership and chose not to attend.
Thing is that if you are working right now, you can’t attend a rally during the day, because, duh, you are working and they don’t let you off work to go attend a rally against them. But things aren’t back to normal and a lot of people who normally do work in this industry, or at least as normally as anyone who isn’t a ’star’ works and who works in the industry in other jobs in between the gigs we really want… aren’t back to work yet from the other strike. This I do not blame on the WGA or SAG, but the studios who are trying to starve us all into submission.
Yes, I was there with my brothers and sisters. If I had been working, I wouldn’t have been able to do it, because no show (I work TV) or studio (my inbetween employment) would give me time off to attend a rally against them. But I resent the inference that because I was not working yesterday and able to attend that that somehow means I’m chronically unemployed or unemployable and just there to ruin the lives of those of you who were working whatever job you have. Tomorrow it could be you who is unemployed — even if it is only a short time between gigs.
Thank you Santayana. The BTL’s got to get some love.
AFTRA President Roberta Reardon took to the air today, appearing on KPPC’s Patt Morrison show to defend AFTRA’s proposed contract. Morrison also interviewed SAG President Alan Rosenberg on tape prior to the live broadcast.
I would like to focus on what Ms. Reardon said about the New Media provisions of the contract. She claimed that AFTRA made significant gains in New Media.
In defending the $15/300/500k New Media exemption provisions of the proposed AFTRA contract, she said – and I’m paraphrasing here, as I just heard it live and did not write it down (go to KPPC for archived audio) – that she doesn’t expect the employers to fund a lot of low-budget New Media productions with strictly non-union actors. In other words, she dismissed our concerns are irrelevant.
Here is the question she was not asked. If the employers aren’t interested in directly producing low-budget New Media projects with 100% non-union talent, why did they push so hard to put that provision in this proposed contract?
More generally, as Ms. Reardon is so quick to play the union card, why would she and the AFTRA negotiators allow ANY signatory employer to employ ANY non-union principal actor on ANY part of the contract? Why would she sanction this most basic violation of good unionism?
I hasten to add this is not about Ms. Reardon personally in any way, shape, or form. My only concerns relate to her actions as president of AFTRA. As president of AFTRA, IMHO, Ms. Reardon did not do a good job defending the New Media provisions of the deal, but then it’s an impossible job, as some of those provisions are clearly indefensible.
For their own sakes and the sake of their own union, AFTRA members need to vote this deal down and send their negotiators back to the table with a clear mandate for a deal that doesn’t eviscerate the rights of actors and the future of their union.
to F AMPTP:
uh…don’t want to point out the obvious…but it’s not just the AMPTP that gets hurt by a strike…everyone, writers, caterers, directors, below the line, designers, artisans, craftsmen, and…you guessed it, ACTORS.
You know I would love to see how much support is shown when the below the line unions try to negotiate their deal. You know the people all around the writers and actors that BREAK THEIR BACK so the show goes on… oh thats right they will get NO SUPPORT from the high dollar players.
Could not agree more with those critical of SAG leadership at this time. The fact that this industry, and those working in it, can be so damaged by this group of idiots is unbelievable. They are beyond rationality, and have moved directly to whipping up mobs, meglomania, and legal bullying of those who dare have a differing view. And I would bet they’re being highly influenced by those shady labor lawyers who are loving all the billing hours. Rosenberg looks like he thinks he’s playing the role of his career, the firey labor leader who stood up to the evil suits.
I cannot believe that the poster calling him/herself “F AMPTP” is actually representative of the membership of the Screen Actors Guild. Trying to throw scare tactics at people and angrily intoning “Be afraid. Be very afraid” is an unfortunate choice. I can completely understand the members of a guild seeking a good and fair contract. I cannot understand threats from anonymous parties.
In this, I think I am in agreement with David Clennon. I may disagree with his positions on issues, but I don’t find him to be making incoherent statements like that one. I empathize with his wish for all the unions and guilds to bargain at the same time and thus extract a decent and workable contract. I don’t know that I will see that happen in my lifetime, but I would be happy if it did. (And David, just to show you I am not an anonymous crank, you may actually remember working with me. I helped out the AD staff on “The Agency” in the fall of 02, specifically filling in for a full week when one of the regular ADs sprained her ankle on location.)
I can’t speak for “high dollar players”, but I can speak for me. I walked the picket line for the WGA, and if a BTL union has their backs put to the wall by the moguls, I will walk with you too. And I know I am not alone.
Agree with mheister: I walked the WGA line, and if the BTLers need my support, I’ll be out there beside them. And there are plenty of us WGAers who feel that way and will walk the walk.
I respect and fully support SAG’s effort to get a contract that is a good template for other actor’s unions and aid’s in securing the futures of performing artists.
I’m not currently a SAG member but I see SAG as where I eventually would like to be because it will mean that I’ve (hopefully) earned some decent credits. Not to say that SAG is necessairly the be all and the end all for actors in this global business, but I have to say that I will be happy when I get there to know that after years of hussling my ass off paying for exorbitant acting schools, monthly classes at 300-500 bucks a pop, workshops, paying for cabs/gas for auditions, taped / edited auditions at my agents request, multiple sets of headshots at $500 (not including the additional cost of reproductions that must be kept on had, the memberships, dues, advertising fees, keeping my hair looking decent, the working out, the dance / yoga classes, and the crappy paying day job that I have to keep happy simultaneously – oh and of course the agency fees, etc. all to maintain what the industry expects of you – that after all that, it’ll be really great to finally get there and rest assured that my integrity won’t be comprimised with bullshit including but not limited to product integration that I wouldn’t see a dime of!?!? Add supported online streaming where I don’t get shit? That’s effing bullshit! Actors are taken advantage of enough as it is but I’ll be dammned if when I finally get to where I want to go only to have my likeness comprimised in such a way! Especially when they’re all receiving sick amounts of money for it, but I’m not thrown a bone? Eff that. It’ll be a sad day if that’s what becomes industry standard of a performer’s future.
“If you want the public sympathy on this, don’t show well known actors. It’s gonna work against you not for you.
Honestly, all this bickering back and forth is not helping anything. It’s really hurting you all.
Comment by TV Fan — June 9, 2008 @ 9:41 pm”
I am a member of the general public and I stand with SAG supporting them 100%. Bring out the well knowns and I will still stand beside SAG. As a matter of fact, it would be a honor to stand beside Justine, Marg H, M Heister and D Clennen.
And if there was some advance planning and I knew they would be there, I would be just as honored to stand beside every single SAG member from The Unit and the other shows I watch.
Just thought I would throw my one cent into this discussion. SAG: I wish I could have been there with you!
Question have the regional SAG members hurt themselves for attending the ralley? I don’t blame you actors who go on strike. U deserve as much of the internet pie,dvd royalites and other new media. Producers and some film companies should hog it all.
As someone who worked in a film myself as an extra I know what hard work on set means. So I’m with you when you strike. Studio execs should feel the heat from you sag working members too. Just my opioin.
“after years of hussling my ass off paying for exorbitant acting schools, monthly classes at 300-500 bucks a pop, workshops, paying for cabs/gas for auditions, taped / edited auditions at my agents request, multiple sets of headshots at $500 (not including the additional cost of reproductions that must be kept on had, the memberships, dues, advertising fees, keeping my hair looking decent, the working out, the dance / yoga classes”
LOL, you’ve been doing this for “years” and still aren’t a SAG member? Maybe it’s time to consider a new line of work…
And all of you claiming you’d walk with BTL’ers are full of it, and you know it. I’m going to laugh when the SAG leaders are finally forced to follow up on their threats and ask for a strike vote, and have it rejected, big-time!
Here’s the thing that irks me most about “my” AFTRA leadership–when SAG goads them they react defensively, which only affirms the preception that AFTRA knows they shortchanged us. AFTRA also continues to point out all the gains they made in this contract,yet what would be more telling would be if they told us what the AMPTP gave up. From what I can tell, they gave up nothing and gave AFTRA next to nothing. That’s not a partnership that’s letting the bully take your lunch money.
Unlike TV fan I am firmly convinced that it would not hurt an A lister or some of the more well-known actors to get out there and stand up to the AMPTP. The A list changes constantly and just as soon as you make it there you can be knocked off of it.
A listers all start in the rank and file pack of actors and many of them finish their careers there. So a little esprit de corps couldn’t hurt the union efforts overall. Because the deals sought are really for the benefit of the rank and file and not just those who could go it alone. And just because you don’t think you need the union today, that’s no guarantee you won’t need the union tomorrow.
To be a real star you not only need to shine for the audience you need to be an example for your fellow thespians.
And for the record I support all the entertainment unions and their members. Because without every member of a production team, good films and TV shows just don’t happen.
VDOVault
Founder of Why We Watch
http://community.livejournal.com/whywewatchljcom
Man so many of us called this months ago during the WGA strike… the WGA and DGA screwed ALL of you… all they had to do was keep working under the old contract until now and negotiating… then everyone could have gone on strike together… but no.. the WGA just had to go it alone, and now becaue of the previous strike most don’t want to strike again.
I have mixed feelings on the subject. On the one hand I know you guys are getting screwed by the AMPTP and deserve the gains you are asking for… on the other hand, look at the state of the business. TV now considered keeping your ratings even an increase. Movie viewership is down year to year. The producers can use this to bolster their case, and to a certain extent they have a point… on the other hand they’re still making a lot of money.
Most people would be quite happy to make $1500/day or work in your positions and under your contracts. Most people in this country as I said before don’t belong to a union or work under a contract (like me). So the perception to average people can be that you’re being greedy when that isn’t necessarily the case.
Oh I’m not in the business to know but was here daily during the WGA strike… and I want to see if you guys are going to support the BTLers as well when it’s their turn… because it doesn’t seem like they get a lot of support from you guys either. Are you going to support them striking after a possible second strike for sag??? Or are you going to say ‘no we’ve had two strikes we can’t do this again!’ after you’ve got your deal in place. We’ll see.
Why are we honoring actors? Honestly, they are normal people who put their pant legs on one leg at a time, doing what they love.
Ever since the beginning of the year SAG has been very anti AFTRA, instead of trying to merge the two unions and go into together and deal with the moguls, they went in separate. And now SAG doesn’t like the deal AFTRA, WGA and DGA made and stuck to.
Well maybe you should have thought of that before you went all anti-AFTRA..
Together would have made a stronger deal…
Responding to the comment by “Here we go again,” June 10 at 4:01pm –
He/she writes about “… how much support is shown when the below the line unions try to negotiate their deal.”
It’s an issue we actors need to address.
This is an exchange I had with “Don’t Be So Short-sighted,” under DHDaily’s “S.A.G. Updates Members … ,” June 8, 2:57pm. It’s followed by a sincere, sad comment from “just a thought.”
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I just read Alan Rosenberg’s letter (6/8)
My wife is a member of I.A.T.S.E.
The crews we actors work with have taken a terrible beating since I started out in the business.
It is my conviction that the men and women who work behind the camera need leaders like Alan Rosenberg and Patric Verrone to stand up and fight for them.
Strong labor leaders can always expect to be villified in the corporate mediums. The more they’re demonized, the more likely it is that they’re doing their job.
On the other hand . . . Maybe Roberta Reardon of AFTRA deserves the genuflections of her profiler — Richard Verrier — in the L.A. Times (June 1).
But the deal she put together with the ruling elite of the AMPTP Will NOT Get MY Vote.
Send them back to the table.
Dave Clennon
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Dave Clennon, the irony is that the actions of Allen Rosenberg and Patrick Verone are the reason why the crews have taken such a beating. Everytime a union creates a work stoppage, it hits the crews the hardest. Furthermore, which you might not realize about how business works is that the studios set a budget for labor (just like any other business). They don’t care how the budget gets allocated, but they make sure they work within the budget to achieve their desired level of profit. So, for every extra dollar Patrick Verone gets for the writers, thats a dollar less available for crew. This will continue until the unions jack up the cost of labor so high that there isnt enough left in the budget to pay non-union labor and then the project gets outsourced.
Comment by Don’t Be So Short-Sighted — June 9, 2008 @ 12:43 pm
Dear “Don’t Be So Short-Sighted”
The decision to shut down the industry rests squarely in the hands of the eight men who rule this town. (And no, it’s not the mayor and the city council.)
I can’t tell whether you’re a real crew member or not. It would help if you didn’t hide behind the fake handle.
You say, “the studios set a budget for labor.” Fair enough. But who told you that that budget is the law of God and the galaxy? It’s a bunch of numbers. They adjust those numbers every day, and if enough workers stand together, those workers can force the suits in the suites to “re-think” that budget — And maybe squeeze a little less profit out of the bodies of the people who ACTUALLY produce the entertainment (crews, writers and actors).
My knowledge, based on living with a 2nd camera assistant, is that crews have been exploited and beaten down, day after day, year after year, by their employers, NOT by writers and actors who have the guts to stand up for themselves and demand just compensation for their work.
The men and women who work behind the cameras have earned my lasting respect for their skills, the honesty and the diligence of their approach to their work, their sense of humor and their sheer endurance.
If the day ever comes when I.A.T.S.E. members get the gumption to overthrow their lazy, feckless leader-collaborators; if the day ever comes when a majority of crew workers decides they’ve taken enough of an unjust screwing from the ruling moguls; if the day ever comes when my I.A.T.S.E. Sisters and Brothers vote to stop working for their rich-get-richer bosses and investors — then I will march beside them and, I swear by this holy planet, I will never cross their picket lines, no matter the personal consequences, because when that day comes, we’ll have Solidarity across the trades and we’ll be as close to invincible as human beings can come.
Actors and writers aren’t the enemies of the crews. Their enemies are our common enemy, the eight executives who rule this town and who decide our fate — until we decide to take our future into our own hands.
Si, la verdad es que — se puede. Cualquier creemos juntos, es posible.
Dave Clennon
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David
WE IA members will never go out on strike. The reason being that whoever the IA president is, he owns our contract. Even if we vote it down our president can approve it over our objections.
Comment by just a thought — June 10, 2008 @ 11:02 pm
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Actors and writers have often failed to treat crew members with the respect and friendliness they deserve. It’s not too late to change our ways.
Has there ever been so much internal turmoil in SAG? Not in the almost thirty years I’ve been a member.
Congratulations, Pres. Rosenberg. Along with the usual suspects, your failure to recognize economic realities may well spell the end of the Screen Actors Guild as a major player in the entertainment industry. You’ll make all the speches about “unity” and being “in solidarity” when in obvious fact, you and your lockstep lemmings have damaged unity and solidarity. SAG is, indeed, a laughing stock.
The studios are successfully putting the screws to us because of the posturing and BS between SAG and AFTRA and the silly nonsense of the BS rhetoric spouting automotons.
For the record, I’ll vote against the AFTRA contract AND any strike authorization called for by Pres. Rosenberg and Mr. Allen.
Oh well. It was a good ride for almost thirty years. Good thing I have my pension and own two outside businesses. SAG’s glory days are over.
I have a genuine fondness for all my peeps in the industry. However, let me just say that when my Production Assistant works a 14 hour day (labor filled) for $150.00 with no overtime, I have sympathy. When my SAG Background Actors make DOUBLE that for the same amount of time, (for mostly sitting around and reading), and when I hear someone complaining that they only made $1500 a day (an entire weeks pay for most crew members), and they had to negotiate their own way out of having their likeness being used after the fact, well for that sympathy- I truly struggle. The wage is so dissproportionate and the economy in such a mess, I do not see a lot of sypathy in the future of striking SAG members. I am tired of hearing about how their rates have to be higher to make sure that the ‘dayplayer’ guys are taken care of imbetween their gigs- well if I can’t get enough work to support myself on the wages that are standard for my position- the rule of society is that you need to look into a different career. We are all fish in this pond and so far there seems to be a few fish hogging all of the food and oxygen.
To all the tough guy WGA members who will “walk to the lines when their BTL brothers go out”, you have a no strike clause. You can’t. Only if you’re unemployed. Which if, as I’ve always suspected, is the case with 98% of the posters here.
It’s a nice thought that all of us someday might have respect for one another. The truth is that this is a business of elitists. All the way down to the craft service guy. Somehow we all think we are better than the next guy, something better to offer. My saying for me is that I’m the second best gaffer in the business the rest are first. I think when we all realize that we all have a niche in this business and everyone is important to project we just might get there. Mutual respect.
btw we have worked together a couple of times, your a smart man and a good actor
BFS:
No, I am not a SAG member. But I am a member of another actors union in another jurisdiction, because there are actors who work in other countries that might not yet have made that crossover. And I will not consider another line of work because despite all the challenges, I love it. And if SAG gets a shitty deal, so will all other actors unions that negotiate with the AMPTP in other juristdictions. So basically it means that yeah – a middle class actor’s future is toast. If you’re not Brad Pitt or Angelina Jolie don’t even bother.
1935 – WAITING FOR LEFTY, by Clifford Odets
Required reading. Carefully and thoroughly.
LOL — Verrone a strong leader???? You mean the guy who called the strike too early then caved at the end… got you no increase in DVD residuals, a crap deal on internet residuals, a no strike clause and no increases if the other unions negotiated better deals? You mean the one who cost the industry hundreds of millions of dollars for essentially nothing since the deal got you almost nothing??? The terms you did get on the deal you would have gotten anyway, without a strike. Verrone, the guy who couldn’t wait 9 months to go on strike with SAG in solidarity or wait to see if another union could negotiate a better deal. You gung ho union guys keep telling yourselves whatever you want to believe. Verrone screwed you all. Oh and don’t forget the strike also gave the tv networks a nice reason to increase their loadup of reality shows that aren’t covered under WGA. So fewer jobs for you writers than before as well. Way to go WGA! You really showed the producers, didn’t you?
The truth is that this is a business of elitists.
I think when we all realize that we all have a niche in this business and everyone is important to project we just might get there. Mutual respect.
Comment by just a thought — June 11, 2008 @ 8:41 pm
Excellent. People say elitists like it’s a bad thing. Why? I’m proud to be among the elite.
And yes, some mutual respect is absoltely in order. I can’t do what I was hired to do if every PA on the set does do what they were hired to do. And if I have to worry about them, my product isn’t as good. Fortunately in my career, I’ve been fortunate to have worked with some great crew people. Never once had a problem with a grip, gaffer, PA or an AD. And the more I do this, the more I appreciate every single other person on the set contributing their skills and talents toward a common goal.
We get to act, sometimes in things people actually see. I get so tired hearing actors with a sense of entitlement constantly whine about their plight. Yes, it’s a business. A tough one. That’s why SAG exists. It’s just sad that the leadership of our Guild sometimes goes astray in it’s dealings, somehow making producers, or even a sister union, the enemy. They aren’t, really. They’re just trying to maximize their profits, just like we are.
@Working SAG Character Actor
Being an elitists and being the elite are two different things. Sorry you missed my point.
@just a thought: Being an elitists and being the elite are two different things. Sorry you missed my point.”
I know. Sorry you missed my twist on it. I guess I didn’t make it clear enough. But no matter. Really not that big a deal. Your point was not missed. Not even argued.