
SUNDAY AM UPDATE: Warner Bros' superhero doomsday thriller with no stars and lots of violence opened to a $25.1 million Friday and $19M Saturday for a blockbuster $55.6M weekend with Sunday's estimate of $11.5M. But that's lower than the $60sM which the studio was hoping for Watchmen.
Exit polling showed that 65% of the audience was male, and of those 65% over the age of 25. But moviegoers didn't necessarily like the movie as shown by a Cinemascore of only "B". However, pumping up Friday's total was the $4.5M from 1,600 Thursday midnight and Friday 12:01 AM shows including all 124 sold-out Imax screenings. (IMAX even added about 20 more 3 AM shows to accomodate the big demand.) And Watchmen has the highest location count for an R-rated opening -- 3,611 theaters -- more than even the record-setting 3,603 venues for the studio's The Matrix Reloaded. This marks the most anticipated superhero movie debut since last summer's The Dark Knight. Only it's not a sequel or remake but a long-awaited big screen retelling of a widely admired and highly creative graphic novel by Alan Moore and Dave Gibbons.
Yet big questions remain: Is the complex story too murky? Is the rampant violence too noxious? Most importantly, will the pic have legs?
Overseas, Paramount is distributing it day and date in 45 major territories for $28M in grosses there. Japan and 14 markets are left to open. (Warner Bros was targeted in a lawsuit by 20th Century Fox to gets its legal piece of Watchmen's proceeds, while Paramount owns 25% and has international distribution.) As for North American box office, I can report that every Hollywood studio was in agreement that the ambitious pic from 300 director Zack Snyder would have an enormous weekend opening. The expected range was high $50sM into the $60sM despite a long running time of two hours, 43 minutes. But now even $60M is impossible. So 300 will remain the highest March opener of all time at $70.9M.
One reason Watchmen did well was the lack of competition. Last week's #1, Disney's Jonas Brothers: The 3-D Concert Experience, sank -78% to make only $850K on Friday and $1.2M on Saturday for just a $2.7M weekend and paltry $16.7M cume (which is either a curse or a blessing depending on your POV.) It's still the 2nd highest grossing concert film of all time. "It played exactly like a concert film with a one-week only engagement," a Disney exec tells me. "The Miley concert, coming off of a sold-out tour and unaffordable concert ticket prices, certainly set the table with unrealistic expectations." But this has to be disappointing given all the JB hype.
Here's the TOP 10 this weekend. (analysis continues below.)
1. Watchmen (Warner Bros) OPENER [3,611 theaters] $55.6M Wkd
2. Madea Goes to Jail (Lionsgate) Week 3 [2,151] $8.8M Wkd, Cume $76.5M
3. Taken (20th Century Fox) Week 6 [3,016] $7.4M Wkd, Cume $118M
4. Slumdog Millionaire (Fox SL) Week 17 [2,890] $6.9M Wkd, Cume $125.4M
5. Paul Blart: Mall Cop (Sony) Week 8 [2,558] $4.2M Wkd, Cume $133.6M
6. He's Just Not That Into You (NL/WB) Week 5 [2,445] $4M Wkd, Cume $84.6M
7. Coraline 3-D (Focus Features) Week 5 [1,959] $3.3M Wkd, Cume $65.6M
8. Confessions of a Shopaholic (Disney) Week 4 [2,290] $3.1M Wkd, Cume $38.3M
9. Jonas Brothers: 3D (Disney) Week 2 [1,276] $2.7M Wkd, (-78%) Cume $16.7M
10. Fired Up! (Sony) Week 3 [1,798] $2.6M Wkd, Cume $13.3M
Of course the comic book fanboys are turning out for their long awaited graphic novel to come to the big screen. But what about everyone else? Turns out that Watchmen is tracking most heavily with older males -- which makes sense since the movie is set in an alternate 1985 America (although Nixon has been played down in the pic). Awareness, interest and first choice is being led by over age 25 males followed by under 25 guys. On one tracking service, younger males have lower awareness but higher interest from those that are aware. Here's what's also interesting: there's high awareness and positive interest from the Latino segment as well as African Americans which is translating into strong first choice numbers in both of those ethnic segments. What does it all mean? "I think that the movie is obviously poised to have an incredible opening," a top Warner Bros exec told me confidently.
The studio is even optimistic about attracting moviegoers from outside Watchmen's sweet spot of males ages 17-to-34. I'm told it's solid across all demos, and even doing well with females. That may be due to Warner Bros' $50 million marketing budget for the movie -- about average for a tentpole these days. The studio invested in a very aggressive campaign that spent big in the outdoor market and on TV advertising. But what's amusing is that rival marketing gurus say they're surprised and impressed by the campaign that's also left them confused what the movie is about or even who the good guys or bad guys are and why. As one of them admired: "The campaign was about planting a big flag in the ground as if to say, 'We are an event. And if you don't understand that, then you're not cool enough to get it'. "
That was indeed the challenge for Sue Kroll and her marketing crew, which is why they created a lot of value-added content to flesh out the very graphic characters. Surprisingly, they chose low-rated NBC to air the most cross promotional spots with the pic's characters -- showcasing Dr. Manhattan during a National Treasure movie, and Rorschach or The Comedian during Heroes. Overall, there was a very robust TV campaign running on all the networks and cable tv. Time was purchased on Lost, CSI, Law and Order, Criminal Minds, WWF Smackdown, NFC/AFC Playoffs, 24, The Mentalist, Fringe, The Office, 30 Rock, all the late night shows on every network, and on and on. Watchmen has also been everywhere online -- MySpace, Yahoo, Facebook, YouTube, IGN, Moviefone, NBC, For Your Imagination, Flizster, Hitifx, and Fandango.
Strangely, the Warner Bros team resisted the obvious tagline for Watchmen that "someone is killing off superheroes". (As close as the marketing came was "We want our superheroes".) Because the difficulty was staying true to the graphic novel as a social and cultural phenomenon but not oversimplifying or overselling it. That meant doing something movie marketers rarely do: accepting that Watchmen is an acquired taste based on a restrictive idea and written as an inaccessible story and then made into a movie that isn't for everyone. This may be a fine strategy to open the pic. But what about the following weekend when Watchmen's negatives are watercooler talk? "I hate to think that, after 2 fucking years of marketing, we're a one weekend movie," a Warner Bros exec confessed to me.
But that's exactly what Hollywood is anticipating. The real disagreement in Hollywood this weekend is not just whether the pic is weird but wonderful, but also whether Watchmen will have legs. As one rival marketing guru quipped, "Probably not. But if you open to $70+M you can get to $150M on your knees." As another agrred: "They will get a lot of initial interest because it's an event movie in March -- and then the bottom falls out. Whether Warner Bros can broaden the campaign to sustain interest in Watchmen is what movie analysts will be watching after this Sunday.


90 mil at least…..nothing is rivaling it, and it has a whole lot more buzz than 300
50Mil-ish, less than 20 week 2.
I’m guessing that Watchmen will pull a Jonas Brothers and seriously underperform relative to the crazy estimates out there. That being said, there is no competition this weekend so it will get business for that reason alone. Nobody outside the comic geek/graphic novel crowd ever heard of it before and even they are split on it. Watch the second weekend and see if it has any real support or just curiosity and the fanboys.
Let’s break some records! Let’s beat 300, the Matrix Reloaded and Passion of the Christ!
could do? please, WILL DO
Remember that the film is nearly 3 hours long; that’s going to limit its gross. $50 million.
I’m predicting 80mil. I work at the Arclight and our shows are selling like nuts. We even just added a fifth midnight showing at 12:45. This movie’s gonna be huge.
40-45 for the weekend. 20-25 week 2.
Isn’t it possible the increase in online sales in comparison with 300 is more likely a result of the fact that consumers are more comfortable with online sales now than they were 2 years ago? I’d like to see a comparison of its actual numbers, not percentages, with more recent comic book releases…
I’m really intrigued to see what comes next in the overall culture of dark age superheroes, and now that seminal entries like Watchmen and Dark Knight are hitting the biggest of the mainstream decades after much that they’ve inspired has, where it will all go from here. There’s a here.
Don’t underestimate the length of this film deterring box office gold. I think $70 million is too high because there will be less showings. Also, this wont be a tent poll movie like “Iron Man” and “The Dark Knight,” but a fanboy flick with typical movie fans attending. And a big second weekend drop is expected.
I agree with “Anonymous — March 5, 2009 @ 8:04 pm” for the most part.
The range for the “Watchmen” weekend estimate has been $50-70 million this week. $60 million is the nice over/under number.
“Watchmen” is opening in 3,611 theaters this weekend. A $10k average per theater for the weekend is a very respectable performance for any film. “The Dark Knight” did $12k PER DAY on its opening weekend for a $36k average.
A $70 million estimate is saying that “Watchmen” will do almost $19.5k per theater for the weekend. That is more than “Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix” did two years ago with a $18k average. That movie had a running time that was 1/2 hour shorter, was rated PG-13, and had significantly more recognition than “Watchmen.” A $70 million estimate would almost be the same performance as “The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King” did on its opening weekend six years ago ($19.6k average and a 1/2 hour longer running time than “Watchmen”).
I’m thinking “Watchmen” does $39.7-45.1 million. That is a $11-12.5k average per theater for the weekend.
HOWEVER, I should note that my estimate for “Twilight” was ridiculously low.
I’m guessing $50 to $65 mil with at least a 70% drop in weekend two. To my mind, the opening weekend gross isn’t nearly as interesting as the legs it does or doesn’t have in the following weeks. I think the drop will be BIG.
And so here we are in the age of film as “product” and all we can do is jabber about “how much will it make?” salivating over the number like a pack of money whores.
It’s over Johnny, it’s over.
“Nobody outside the comic geek/graphic novel crowd ever heard of it before and even they are split on it.- Joe Melnick ”
Just because you are too dumb to have heard of it doesn’t mean it isn’t outside that niche crowd. Watchmen is huge, bigger than just the comic crowd thanks the the book market and the fact it has been for nearly 2 decades now “the greatest comic ever”. Wake up son.
I hope it does 90m, then the newspapers can write another article about our recession proof industry where: DVD is dying (see sony layoffs), the ad market is shit. But hey, the box office is great and we’re all getting rich. Seriously, when is someone at a major paper going to write that story instead of the feel good crap. Nikki???????????????
I don’t believe ‘Watchmen’ is going to have legs for two simple reasons. At the screening I attended, I saw about half a dozen women walk out (with dates in tow) during the (attempted) rape scene, and peals of laughter during the (non-coercive) sex scenes.
And despite the agressive fanboy marketing, the feedback I’ve been hearing (you know, the stuff that drives the kind of word of mouth no marketing budget can buy) has been tepid.
@CineFileX
I case you had not noticed: this is not a site about movie quality. No star-ratings, thumbs up or down, stuff like that.
This site is about money. Who is still in the business and can make money, who lost money yet again, who is hired, who is fired.
Movie quality is usually only lamented
See Paul Blart.
With the theatre counts and screen numbers, I have to revised my estimation.
I give it north 50M opening weekend just cause of it overtly-long screen time. That said, it’s the 2nd week BO performance that will tell how well is the pic being rcvd by the masses.
I really want this pic to do well but having read some of the reviews from my trusted (and of same taste reviewers), seems like its all hype and lacking of substance that will make this pic one to remember for all the wrong reasons.
Here’s hoping I am wrong!
“I’m thinking “Watchmen” does $39.7-45.1 million. That is a $11-12.5k average per theater for the weekend.
HOWEVER, I should note that my estimate for “Twilight” was ridiculously low.”
Aaaaand your estimate for Watchmen is ridiculously low. It’s pretty clear you have no idea about trends among youth. There is no doubt this does 60m. None. In all likelihood, it’ll do closer to 70.
It probably will have a fairly large drop if nothing else due to the fact that it has some competition next weekend. I think if it does 70m, it’ll get close to 200m in the end though. Probably finish up around 185.
As someone who is female, 18-24, and hasn’t read the graphic novel, I can say with relative confidence that this film will have a great run at least through the second weekend. The rich cinematography is overwhelming the first go-round, and Snyder’s been smart enough to layer the film for multiple viewings.
Reading the graphic novel twice before I saw the movie last night I can definitely say that on a first time viewing it was a mixed bag. It should’ve been longer. There was too many little detals missing from the graphic novel that would’ve made the movie much more multi-dimensional. But I know that after the movie was over I thought to myself ‘wow what a refreshing change of pace of the usual bullshit that plagues the multiplexes on a weekly basis.’ Its not perfect, I don’t think any movie really is(maybe the Godfather pts.I-II)but it’s different and it has an identity of its own, its not asking you for acceptance. All the performances I thought were really well done. I don’t know why critics are harping on Matthew Goode and Malin Ackerman, they did a pretty damn good job making those characters come to life — especially Jackie Earl Haley and surprisingly Patrick Wilson whom I normally don’t like all that much, they were the standouts. Gotta see it again to get a more balanced opinion.
I would like to suggest that the concept of film as product is a fluid one. For that all important first week, yes, it is product and reduced to numbers, but if it is to survive the business of weeks to come it must be more. It must resonate as a story and a visual art if the seats are to continue to be filled.
There is no battle between art and business, they’ve become fluid companions.
“The studio is even optimistic about attracting moviegoers from outside Watchmen’s sweet spot of males ages 17-to-34. I’m told it’s solid across all demos, and even doing well with females. That may be due to Warner Bros’ $50 million marketing budget for the movie –”
- Really? I have yet to find a woman who knows of it (past any imagery), much less expressed interest in seeing it. This is an R rated dude film. If your being told that from WB I call BS. WBBS.
FWIW – I’m a semi-reformed fanboy who read this issue for issue as it came out in the 80’s, and have my IMAX ticket for tomorrow. And I do have a date this evening – I did say semi-reformed.
Running time as a factor in box office may be somewhat overrated. Watchmen runs 161 minutes. Dark Knight was effectively the same length (in terms of available showtimes), 152 minutes.
The highest grossing film of all time, Titanic, runs 194 minutes. The highest grossing film of all time in real (adjusted) dollars, Gone With The Wind, tips the scales at a whopping 226 minutes.
The Sound of Music, 174 minutes. The Godfather, 175. To cite a few examples.
Predicted warm weather this weekend in Northeast (after a long cold spell) will help.
50mm P+A seems low. Probably more like 65mm +.
These guys have to do 200m world-wide to make even a little bit of money.
Not sure what the business model is there.
‘Watchmen’ will probably have legs because of older white men, similar to ‘Gran Turino’ and ‘Taken’. Word-of-Mouth will be strong because older men are drawn to masculin male figures in films with intellegent dialogue and strong action. It is possible that they will be turned off by the high gore, but I think older white men will carry this movie.
It won’t do as well as “300″ for a number of reasons:
1. Its longer than 300 by almost an hour
2. The story is much more complicated
3. No male supermodels in loin cloths.
The length of the film issue is self-explaintory. The complexity of the story will deter second viewings. The lack of Gerard Butler and crew running around half-naked will hurt its chances with the ladies (Billy Crudup-voiced naked CG superhero not withstanding).
Harold – Harry Potter 5 and LOTR3 both opened on Wednesdays so their Fri-Sun openings were smaller than they should have been. Had they opened on a Friday, they would have had $100M+ opening weekends.
Also the 3,611 theater count includes the 124 Imax runs. The Friday gross (including Thu midnight) will be a huge portion of the 3-day, maybe 40-45%. Could be mid-60s for the weekend.
It’s going to be huge, both this weekend and next. The buzz is everywhere. I’m a 61 year old male and, having heard about the movie months ago, I bought and read the novel. One of the most fun reading experiences I’ve had in years. Yeah, the plot is so-so but the telling of the story is incredible. And although I am bound to be somewhat dissapointed – since the telling of the story isn’t likely to translate well to the screen – I’m curious as hell and will see it by next weekend.
I just wish the marketing hadn’t tried to cram Zach Snyder’s “visionary” status down our throats. The real visionaries of his films are the vfx animators. I don’t see how visually transcribing famous graphic novel source material from Frank Miller and Alan Moore makes somebody a visionary. Dawn of the Dead ‘04 was pedestrian in these terms.
“Remember that the film is nearly 3 hours long; that’s going to limit its gross.”
Those days are long over.
who fucking cares how much money this movie makes? do any of you run studios? is it a fun movie or not, that’s the most important question to be asking
I’m going into hibernation until November, when movies for grown-ups are released.
The big opening numbers are interesting, but is that the rabid fan base response only? Will the theaters be empty over the weekend as a result? If not, prepare for more comic book movies as Hollywood appears to be gearing up for more production. I’ve even heard web comics like Pyramids of Mars are getting a second look
not bad for a p.o.s. movie
then again, when has warner bros or fox really made anything of quality lately?
well, it does matter how much money it makes for several reasons. after all the courtroom/rights issues, several studios are attached and one studio in particular put up most of the budget and as much as i hate comic book films, the industry is in such a state that if this film doesn’t do good, it could mean even more layoffs.
I myself, will not be seeing it, I agree, I’d like to see movies actually made for adults – female adults. After Dark Knight and Iron Man I do not need to see another frikin explosion on the big screen ever again!
@actionman
Unfortunately no, it’s not fun, it’s laborious and if you haven’t read the book, makes no sense.
Eh.Not a fanboy. Zach makes racist trash. And can somebody PLEASE buy him a light bulb for christ sakes?
Jon: Please do go into hibernation. We can enjoy interesting pieces of pop art, while you wait for Stephen Daldry to make a another shallow piece of Oscar Bait. You’re such a cliche it’s not even funny.
WB better enjoy the opening week numbers because based on the responses on the “Yahoo movies board” this movie is getting more F’s than any movie I have seen in a long time. Says one movie goer…” People in the theatre were stunned at how bad this “blockbuster” movie was. There were dozens of groups standing around complaining. I felt so sorry for the poor saps who came in costume. The general consensus was that the highlight of the evening were the previews of Star Trek, Wolverine and Terminator. It was all downhill after that.” But then again People seem to relish the thought of spending million on preceived mediocre films.
“Aaaaand your estimate for Watchmen is ridiculously low. It’s pretty clear you have no idea about trends among youth.”
The estimate? Possibly.
Youth? They’re the weakest component of interest for “Watchmen.” EVERY survey shows men over 25 having the most awareness and interest. The youth are generally passing on this. However, those who are aware have strong interest. It’s just not a lot of them.
If “Watchmen” does $30 million or more today (including the midnights), it might do $65 million on a likely declining basis (i.e., 30F-20Sa-15Su).
“Watchmen” did $4.6 million at its 1,595 midnight performance locations. “The Dark Knight” did $18.5 million at 3,040 midnight performance locations. “The Dark Knight” midnight grosses represented 11.6% of a weekend that would total $155.3 million.
$4.6 million is 11.6% of $39.41 million. My estimate for Watchmen this weekend is $39.7-45.1 million.
If anything, I’m currently overestimating “Watchmen.”
Was at the Arclight Hollywood screening this morning at 10:35. A couple of people in the less-than-quarter-filled theater cheered when the usher introduced the film, but then everybody just kind of filed out at the end. Heard one guy talking about the blue cock and “how sexy the sex scene was.”
Pretty low-key, but it IS “Watchmen.” Not really expecting the post-”I AM Iron Man” cheering section.
My opinion? Zack Snyder proves that, in fact, he just wasn’t good enough to direct “Watchmen.” Some really, really great moments, but not a great film.
I think they should track by grouping people into “fat people” and “not fat people” rather than ethnicity.
I don’t give a rats ass what it makes or doesn’t make this weekend. It still SUCKED and I wanted that 2 hours and 40 minutes back! It’s a pathetic attempt at a good movie. The only good thing is I got to see it for free.
“Those days are long over”? Really? Have time machines and worm holes been installed in movie theaters? Because the last time I checked, there are only so many hours in the day, which is going to limit the number of showing you can run and ultimately effect the number of tickets you can sell.
Hoberman’s review of ‘Watchmen’ in The Village Voice sums up Zack Snyder perfectly: ‘visionary director’ = ‘competent hack’. I actually quite enjoyed his remake of ‘Dawn of the Dead’, but I’d no interest in either ‘300′ or this film.
Just got home from seeing this film. It was what it was glad to see it. I have only one side comment because I’m a little shocked THAT PARENTS ARE BRINGING 5, 6, 7 year olds to this film. WHAT IN THE WORLD ARE THEY THINKING. It just pissed me off.
Saw it.
They blew it.
It sucks.
Come on people, this movie is not going to gross more than 40 million. The 6:45PM showing at my theater had a total of 68 people (500 seat theater). This is NOT a good sign as the same screen’s 7:00PM showing of Madea and Friday both sold out on their opening nights.
“WB better enjoy the opening week numbers because based on the responses on the “Yahoo movies board” this movie is getting more F’s than any movie I have seen in a long time.”>
Comment by jdls08 — March 6, 2009 @ 2:56 pm
But it’s at B+ right now. Maybe you’re reading the reviews sorted by Lowest Grade?
Anyone dissing Watchmen is a racist.
Fox made the right call on this one years ago.
This won’t shatter any record for R rated movie opening! The Matrix Reloaded still the bigget R rated movie opener of all the time with an outstanding US$ 91 million! yep, Neo wins!
With a $25 million Friday start, “Watchmen” is likely not going to see $70 million this weekend.
If you think it will maintain audience over the weekend similar to “300,” that would result in $63.1 million.
If you think it will maintain audience over the weekend similar to “The Dark Knight,” that would result in $59 million.
Here’s a safe prediction: “Watchmen” won’t hold as well as either of those two.
I agree Harold. Its not gonna hold; $55M is probably likely. Still, for a movie based on a graphic novel that 99.997% of the country has never heard of, not too shabby.
WB better enjoy the opening week numbers because based on the responses on the “Yahoo movies board” this movie is getting more F’s than any movie I have seen in a long time.”>
Comment by jdls08 — March 6, 2009 @ 2:56 pm
But it’s at B+ right now. Maybe you’re reading the reviews sorted by Lowest Grade?
WELL IT HAS COME DOWN TO A “B” AS OF RIGHT NOW AND LOOK FOR IT TO GO DOWN EVEN FURTHER. This is not good as the yahoo users are usually very generous with their ratings and if you are getting a B or lower it isn’t good if your a studio hoping to have LEGS.
I seem to be in the minority. I went with an open mind (and a homemade Rorschach shirt) to the first screening this morning at 10:30am and was sorely disappointed. They took all the life out the story and made it into a snooze-fest with some violent bits randomly thrown in to wake up those who were texting on their cellphones (as most of my audience was out of boredom).
I am a big fan of the graphic novel (note the homemade shirt), and went with an open mind, but this film really left me cold. All of my friends seemed to like it, but I can’t really see a pattern as to why (no reasons are given, just more, “OMFGthatwassocool.”) I’m wondering if some theaters had built-in subliminal mind control to make people say they liked it upon leaving the theater.
It left such a bad taste in my mouth, I had to remember why I loved the graphic novel so much in the first place and shove the film clearly out of my mind.
But that’s just me. The minority. *shrug*
Yahoo user ratings don’t mean much. Are we seriously discussing that?
Mainstream America isn’t smart enough for this film.
I’M SORRY THE MOVIE WAS AWFUL ! I didn’t get to watch it for free so that sucks ! It was distasteful and nearly 12 people walked out.
Having looked at the cross country numbers, this film is heavily multiplexed and Imax driven… Triples, Quads and even some 5 & 6 screen complexes are getting killed with it coming in at 1/3 of the national PSA. That means this picture is going to have a quick death after this weekend. Watch the numbers on Saturday. If it drops close to 15% or better, this picture is finished. Why am I smelling a repeat of Ang Lee’s HULK all over again?
I’m sorry to say, but if this abortion of a movie makes Mr. Snyder a “visionary”, then I guess it means he is in dire needs of glasses. What made the book visionary is exactly NOT the narrowminded focus on the “costumes” so much, but the impact they have on the world around them. Take the psychiatrist, for example. In the movie? a plot point. In the book Moore uses him effectively to make the point that psychosis can almost spread like a disease. None of it is here. And while Tse and Hayter lifted chunks of Moore’s dialogue from the book, they reshuffled the words, strung them together in ways they were never intended to be. Now, in your usual retarded “movie” sense of the way that goes “Who cares who says the lines as long as they are being said” that apparently is quite the norm there… that might make perfect sense.
Even at the beginnign. The whole POINT of listening to Roschach’s mad ramblings “blood in the gutters… yadda… yadda… yadda…”, ending with “And all of a dudden, nobody can think of anything to say” is to COUNTER it with the police detectives saying. “Hm. That’s quite a drop” while looking down from Blake’s balcony onto the street below.
Most of Moore’s lines not only have double, sometimes triple meaning, they are also very often the structural skeleton of the novel itself, giving multiple viewpoints and jumping off the art, not merely complimenting it but often juxtaposing the very thing you saw.
This abortion of a movie is not particularly helped by a cast that showed the talent of a Junior High School production, surrounded by 150 million dollars o highly stylised, but ultimately moronic special effects. His feverish love for showing ultra violence (you needed to show the bone breaking out the thug’s skin during one fight in close up slow motion? Really? Did that add anything? Really?)
The ending is supposedly trading the “comic book villainy” for something “realistic”, but not only took it away from the whole point of operatic grandeur, not only did it fall flat on its face with a loud “thunk”, it had the audacity to give the readers of the book the middle finger by naming the operation “S.Q.U.I.D.” Ha! Ha! Ha! And what a good laugh THAT must have been around the table, eh? The whole point of Veidt was that he WAS a Bond-ish villain, that he did think in those grand operatic schemes… and that the big reveal of it was, he did it all to save “the earth” (well, not in the Keanu Klatuu way, *shudder*, but still…)
Maybe Snyder has read the book repeatedly, but like a bad student his delivery here resembles a 2nd grade summary of what Moore wrote. Like, uh, then there were those murders, and the cool guy with the shifting mask, he, uh, and Batman, uh, Night Owl can’t get it up. Hahahaha.
Dear God, man, have you even READ the book? Or did you just look at the pretty pictures?
The musical choices? Dear god, no. Just… no. No. Sorry. No. Cohen? Really? What? Was “You’re my thrill” by Billie Holiday taken? Or did it not go with your whole “the times are dark, man, really dark, and like, that song, like doesn’t encapsulate it.”
He didn’t even get the joke about Rorschach going to the loo during the prison breakout. Now, is that joke necessary to any plot or anything? No. But IF you decide to MAKE that joke, then MAKE the JOKE. And the joke is NOT “Rorschach in costume goes to beat the shit out of a little dwarf in a toilet”. The joke is that Walter Kovacs – from the point of view of his friends – takes a moment to take a leak… and only THEN do we realise he beat the snot out of the little dwarf.
Monkeys could have done a better job out of that.
What Snyder has achieved is the same thing he achieved with “300″. He created a slobbering blow job to single panels, which I am sure pleased Dave Gibbons to no end. Unfortunately, he tried to deal with an actual BOOK this time and not a singularly expressive, but rather retarded fighting orgy performed by men in short, short skirts.
In an interview Snyder said that if this fails he might be relegated to directing romantic comedies for the rest of his life. And I for one wish him exactly that kind of punishment.
Didn’t understand your reference to Nixon in 1985? Reagan was president then. Or is history just an illusion too?
I purposely stayed away from the novel, having read it years ago, because I wanted the pure experience of seeing the movie on its own terms and I thought it was terrific. A densely layered, perfectly paced, intelligent adult drama that seemed over too soon. There were also some terrific performances. Jackie Earl Haley’s Rorschach was insane like The Joker but with a too strong sense of morality, albeit skewered and weird. I’m going back again today because it was almost too much to take in at one viewing.
loved it
as a long time fan who took 3 others (who has no idea what this was about going into it ) to a sold out 9:00 am screening
asking them what they thought (M69 , F59 , F21) , they came away impressed
liking this nearly as much as the Dark Knight
and more then Iron Man
none of the 3 , do not read comic books
but the F21 told me she was going out today
to buy the book
as she wanted to have “more” of the story
a good sign!
“I’m a little shocked THAT PARENTS ARE BRINGING 5, 6, 7 year olds to this film. WHAT IN THE WORLD ARE THEY THINKING.”
It’s cheaper to pay for therapy than a babysitter?
I saw it yesterday and thought it was very good. I didn’t read the book first so I would not try to compare it to the film.
I did want to respond to some of the anti consumer comments by the Hollywood bunch on this board. You denigrate and deride the “fan boys”, “nerds”, and “geeks” that have kept your industry from collapsing over the last 30 years. Without them you would be groveling for pennies to make your elitist crap about pedophiles and communists. The film business was going the way of the dodo before Star Wars and the blockbuster movies came out and gave people a reason to go to the movies again. You laud weirdos like Woody Allen whose last funny movie I paid to see was Sleeper. Keep it up and you will be begging for an Obama handout so you can make the drivel you so love and no one wants to pay to see.
The poster for this film should read “From Visionary Marketer Sue Kroll,” as the only extraordinary thing about the movie was that it actually created enough buzz to necessitate and fill midnight screenings.
Can we please stop calling Zack Snyder “visionary?” The film is visually stunning, yes (full credit to the DoP and VFX crew), but a true visionary would have found a way to adapt the graphic novel into an actual story instead of shooting it frame for frame from the book (and yes, I know they changed the ending — definitely for the better — but that’s not enough of an “adaptation”…).
It takes TWO HOURS to introduce the characters and back story, then they finally put on their damned outfits and the “story” begins, only to end a handful of scenes, and a few ridiculous, unmotivated, dramatic turns later.
There’s nothing driving the narrative. The world is ending, but the characters constantly take time outs to get naked and chat about old times. It’s boring as hell.
The worst part is, the concept is fascinating. With its “regular people as heroes” theme and its “what will one man do when he’s given the power of God?” thread, it could really have appealed to a population desperately seeking heroes and omniscient leaders to take care of the world’s current crises. But, too afraid to upset fanboys (have fanboys ever embraced an adaptation anyway? What is hollywood so afraid of?), the film plods along, hitting the key scenes and moments from the book, while ignoring the rest of the audience who came to see an actual movie with a story, a plot, and some dramatic tension. It’s a terrible waste of a potentially great premise.
The film may make $60 million this weekend, though I doubt it. Everyone at the midnight screening I attended left feeling empty and cheated, the only applause at the end coming from the costumed fanboys, clearly too embarrassed to admit they’d just gotten dressed up for such a lacklustre film. With the poor word of mouth, I imagine it will stumble into Monday morning with $45 to $55 million, rake in another $25 next weekend, plod its way to $100 million domestic, sell a bunch of Limited Edition DVDs on the release date, then die the slow death of being forgotten on the shelves of America.
There’s nothing lasting about the film — no great saga, no adventure, no endearing, complicated, relateable characters to cheer on — and so no reason to watch it again, nor any reason to tell anyone else to do so.
It might be deemed a success by Monday morning quarterbacks, but if it only makes $100 – $150 million domestic during its run, it’s a huge failure. The source material is beloved and great, the built-in fan base is huge, the themes in the original work are universal and very current, and yet no one was “visionary” enough to adapt it into a great movie that might appeal to a mass audience, only “visionary” enough to trick people into seeing the mediocre final product.
It’s a real shame.
———
Two side notes:
1. I hope “sideofsarcasm” is being sarcastic when she says, as an 18-24 year-old female, she thinks the film will have legs. It’s the most blatantly misogynistic film I’ve seen in years. Female audience members left my screening as it seems they left others. Say what you will about the idea in the film that the Comedian parodies the ultra-violent nature of humanity, the worst misogyny comes in the final scene when mother Silk Spectre excuses all of his behaviour to her daughter. So awful.
2. While I direct a lot of criticism at the storytelling, I would like to give kudos to the actors, especially Crudup, Haley, and Wilson who really did their best with what they were given.
Not sure where most of you saw this, but i went to a packed house screening in times square and they LOVED IT! There seems to be this backlash that comes around when properties that have a built in cult audience come to theaters (Twilight,Potter, etc..) where people who don’t know or are new to it tend to criticize, because they’re “not in on it”. Most of the people i saw it with are people who work in the comic industry and or tv/film, and though there is agreement to reserve judgement until we’ve seen the complete director’s cut, we all feel that he got alot more RIGHT than wrong. This movie will do about $150 mil domestic, about $300 worldwide, and TONS on Blu-ray/DVD. BTW, the term “visionary” doesn’t have much to do with performances, hence the term VISION-ary, whether you like the film or not you hav to admit it’s visually striking (Opening sequence a stand out), and that has MUCH more to do with Snyder than his D.P., anyone who seen his commercial/ music video work knows that for a fact.
The number of comments on this alone indicates the amount of interest in this film. Even so, I predict a HUGE open, a 50% drop in weekend 2 and then it disappears like Dr. Manhattan after a bad news conference.
Forget about week 2. You’re going to see the drop begin today on day 2.
“Watchmen” should be looking at a 33-50% drop today from Friday, but likely closer to the 33% than the 50%. The exit polling confirmed the surveys from earlier in the week – i.e., mostly older males. They are largely one and done, so a significant percentage of those who were going to see “Watchmen” has already done so.
Nikki’s posted revised estimate of $55 million fits the model of a first weekend collapse over the three days. Starting with a Friday (including midnights) of $25.1 million, a 33% drop on Saturday, and a Sunday result that is 50% of Friday results in $54.2 million.
Anecdotal word of mouth is very bad on this film. Huge drop off next weekend; its going to limp to $130 mil domestic.
Well, there’s no arguing that this is a GREAT film on any level, because it’s not.
But it may just be the greatest and biggest-budget fan film of all time. It’s certainly going to be the death of the “slavishly faithful” comic book adaptations.
If you are not a fan of the book, don;t even bother seeing the movie.
Btw, i think the Watcher is totally wrong in his assesment of the “life” of this film. When the Director’s cut (45 extra minutes) comes out alot of fanboys will have the version THEY wanted to see, instead of the edited down “commercial” version WB released. Alot of the details they cut out dulled the impact of the “reveals” of the film, there are ENTIRE SUBPLOTS IGNORED, fanboys are merely seeing the theatrical version as an appetizer for the main feast.
Watchmen has been the ONLY comic book release since The Dark Knight.
To The Watcher:
When Silk Spectre “excuses” his behavior we the audience do not. But the point is she is a flawed person, human, who makes decisions she’s deeply ashamed of. Like the abused wife who still loves her husband. The Comedian’s behavior is always presented as disgusting, which is why she has so much shame. She’s a mess. But we don’t hate her for it, but rather try to have sympathy.
The watchmen was the stupidest movie ever! This just proves how dumb the audiences are today.
The amazing thing is, by looking at the numbers, this movie was entirely IMAX & multiplex driven. Any twins, triples, quads, even five screen theaters, they all got creamed. Bank on a minimum 15% drop tonight and if that happens, this film is D.O.A.
“Really? I have yet to find a woman who knows of it (past any imagery), much less expressed interest in seeing it. This is an R rated dude film.”
You cannot be serious. Any woman with literary chops has read it and is at least curious about a movie adaptation. Watchmen is one of the single most important works of the 20th Century, not just some fanboy wank. I admit to being nervous that Hollywood would ruin it, but I was pleased with the film, and so were most of my 30-something female peers.
This movie has no stars. The public is left asking “Who the hell are these people?” Yes, stars have been overpaid in the past, but they still have value. Will Smith instantly adds $20 million to the box office. Charlize Theron adds maybe $3 million and Jessica Alba around $1 million or less. And that’s what they should be paid. Adjust all the stars’ salaries sharply downward, but keep using them.
This cast is a repeat of Speed Racer, Superman Returns, and the aborted Justice League. People don’t care about these non-stars. In a perfect world the public would embrace little known character actors as leads. But this isn’t that world. This is a world of star-f*ckers and 5 billion celebrity magazines and star-stalker websites. TV Smallville’s Jimmy Olsen has more fans than the last big screen Superman actor. Miley Cyrus is more famous than all of the Watchmen cast combined. She presented at the Oscars for god’s sake. Did any of the Watchmen’s non-stars rate that red carpet exposure? The moviegoing public loves their stars. The studios just need to pay those stars a lot less than they used to.
I did think the plot was perhaps a little too murky for the non-intitated. Plus the bloatedness reduced the impact of what is a thought-provoking story.
I was not appalled by the violence though a few moments were probably a little too over the top. I thought it was incredibly uneven and most of the acting was forgettable. Jackie Earle Haley was stunning though and there were some very beautiful shots.
Despite its weaknesses, the movie intrigued me… mostly because it let me see that Akira and Death Note might actually work as live-action adaptations.
Saw it on IMAX in White Plains NY this afternoon. The theater was not filled to capacity the way “300″ was in that very same theater. The movie didn’t play to the audience very well. The crowd was silent througout and there were scattered boos at the end. I appreciated Snyder’s direction. But this film will have no appeal outside of the fans of the comic. Next weekend will be a disaster once word of mouth by non fans of the comic spreads. Before I saw it, 3 people told me the trailer was deceptive. And they all never read the comic and hated the film. Again I appreciate Snyder’s attention to detail, but this movie is waaaaaay too limited in it’s appeal outside the base. Also, why isn’t Jeffrey Dean Morgan famous yet?
“Yahoo user ratings don’t mean much. Are we seriously discussing that?”
Comment by TerryKeefe — March 6, 2009 @ 11:44 pm
Well, evidently you don’t know what you are talking about. Granted the ratings aren’t scientific but what film ratings are, but, the yahoo board probably has more people (sometimes 20,000 responses) telling you what they like or don’t like from every age group which is a pretty good sampling of what is a hit or not. One other thing to consider these responses usually are in tune with movies that are hits or blockbuster and or a dud. So when a film hits the B or lesser rating it means a lot of D or Fs from moviegoers.
I guess Im not surprised with these numbers. I know comic books from my childhood, hardly a fanboy (call me a fan man); Superman, Batman, X-Men, Iron Man. But who are the Watchmen? It looks good, but Im not invested. And no Heath Ledger or Robert Downey Jr? The ads with the character profiles should have gone wider then airing on the lowest network.
a couple brought a young child to this film at arclight grove theatre friday afternoon, when I saw the film (not bad, too pat an ending for silk and owl).
unbelievable bad judgment on the part of the parents – I don’t care if the child wasn’t old enough to stay with the film, the imagery was very disturbing. where were theatre managers to discourage this (apart from the kid’s noise making)?
unbelievable
Nobody I know in Hollywood understands why the 300 kicked butt so hard yet, though it’s blatantly obvious to people who live outside the biz, and it isn’t present in any form in Watchmen. Here’s a clue, it isn’t visuals, it’s an emotion, just not one film execs are comfortable discussing anymore. I predict 300 kicks Watchmen to the curb.
RE: Trey
It’s ironic that you criticize the “commercial” version of Watchmen that WB released, considering there is very little “commercial” about this film at all. Having just seen it tonight (in a half-full theater, with some parents who, of course, misjudged the advertising and brought young kids), this movie is admirable in its ambition, but does not work as a “feature length” film in any way whatsoever. It’s a series of patchwork “moments” lifted almost entirely word-for-word from its source material, and ultimately fails to build any momentum, any thrill, any real lasting emotion in an already too-long hodge-podge of superhero conundrums and melodramatic cliches. I have read Watchmen. Any film ‘adapted’ from this material should at least have been adapted to a genuinely compelling cinematic experience — very little in this film holds lasting attention, apart from perhaps Crudup’s Dr. Manhattan. WB took a big risk on this, the same kind of slavish-devotion-to-cultural-memory they took with Superman Returns, but considering Watchmen’s limited comic audience, and the seeming lack of audience for this ‘film,’ I think it’s going to backfire on the studio in an even bigger way.
And in my small attempt to start a sure-fire controversy with any Drudge readers who might have stopped over, by the way, what’s with the very prominent placements of the Twin Towers in at least ten shots? They *just happen* to lie directly in the line of sight of Veidt’s corporate office window, they also *just happen* to lie directly in the background of a cemetery (seemingly on the other side of town), they also *just happen* to be nearby the sewer entrance that Nite Owl’s ship exits from, and this is the best one, they *just happen* to survive in pristine, untouched form when *SPOILER* a significant portion of NYC is destroyed in a nuclear holocaust at the end of the film. Snyder’s attempt to “say something” here about the enduring nature of our “symbols” is as convoluted and unclear as everything in the film itself.
Poor form. Bad judgment. Hollow “movie.”
I fell in love with this film when I saw the trailers back at christmas. It was worth the wait; all I have to say it blew me away and I have the graphic comic novel which it followed real closely. Just the alternate ‘85 setting had been enough to hook me in. This one had a real comic book flair about it and after I saw the film I snatched a Watchman figure in the local bookstore. Silk Spectre series one. I like this one better. I hope Alan Moore does a graphic novel sequel to this one. A stand alone.
I’m not familiar with the Watchmen but I did see the movie. It was a well made film. This is more of a comic fan movie.
“I agree Harold. Its not gonna hold; $55M is probably likely. Still, for a movie based on a graphic novel that 99.997% of the country has never heard of, not too shabby.”
WINNER – !! – RandomnDude!
ps. Loved the movie – walked out wanting to go back in and see it again. Never read the novel. Age 43 Sex M
I watch every new movie that comes out on Pirate Bay. Cam, Screener or R5. So much of it is crap – not worth buying on DVD much less the US$24.95 Costco wants for the blu-ray version of”The Duchess.” I just saw TW this evening – I will purchase the blu-ray version of this – it is a layered wonderfully fun movie.
I’m not surprised about the Jonas’ falling down. It’s just crazy how can someone take 3 little mocosos, dress them in fancy clothes, get them a hair stylist and send them to a sound lab in order to force sound into a set of tracks. Artificially created popularity can only last so long. The 15 minutes are over.
I know I’m enjoying all the negative reviews. The book never should have been made into a movie in the first place. This is a one weekend and done.
The people who are saying the movie won’t make money because of its lack of Box Office stars are wrong — just look to “300″ for the opposing argument. Or the sudden bomb of the Jonas Bros. concert flick, which I find quite satisfying. Those bros are hollow and nearing the end of their 15 minutes — not an ounce of charisma in the trio.
I attended the midnight Watchmen screening with five other demo targets: Men 30-45. Everybody liked it, couple loved it, the two guys who hadn’t read the book found the mystery portion convoluted, but enjoyed all the characters and the spectacle. The audience — admittedly the hardcore fanboys — cheered at the beginning and the end. My gf went with her 15 y.o. daughter the next day and they liked/loved it, respectively.
Whether the movie makes money or not, I think we all should applaud the daring, almost uncompromised vision at work here. Snyder stuck with the story’s unpleasant elements, right down to the brutal and anti-heroic finish, the rape scene, Dr. Manhattan’s dick and more.
I’m honestly amazed by the ambivalent response the film is getting from critics. I thought it was very close to brilliant and definitely very brave. Again, I’m exactly the target, and I’ve read the book twice. But this is a much better movie than, say, “Titanic.”
“Any woman with literary chops has read it and is at least curious about a movie adaptation.”
AWV – How UNTRUE. It was published as an f-ing comic book, which mo amount of “Greatest Literary Lists” can overcome. Not only are you expecting unitiated women to pick up a comic book for perhaps the first time in their lives, you’re asking them to pick up 12 issues with 4-6 pages of full page text in the back.
I was at a film with one of my best female friends about 6 months ago. She saw the trailer and asked “Is this Justice League?” before the title came up.
Look at the tracking numbers: they back up what I’m saying.
Watchmen held together better on Saturday than I expected, but it was still a 26% slide from Friday’s numbers. A $55 million estimate assumes that Sunday’s number will be a 55% slide from Friday.
It looks like it will be a disastrous second weekend. The Dark Knight and 300 both had 50%+ declines on week 2. The Incredible Hulk slid 60%.
Here is the bad news. The Incredible Hulk had slides of 14% (Saturday) and 28% (Sunday) from its Friday opening. Watchmen lost audience at double that rate.
This will be the fanboy POV: If Watchmen’s $4.5 million midnight shows are excluded, Watchmen only declined 9% (Saturday) and 25% (Sunday) from Friday’s opening.
But that is still close to an “Incredible Hulk” performance.
Watchmen isn’t going to see $20 million next weekend. It may not even see $15.
Watchmen can’t crawl to $150 million domestic with this weekend’s numbers.
Some of your comments especially about the twin towers,Richard Nixon,sounds like your unfamiliar with alternate histories. Watchmen is a fine example of Alternate 80s. I caught the twin towers shot too. And in the real 80s the twin towers were still up and not considered a terrorist target then. Now with President Richard Nixon,he’d been elected for a third term,the Vietnam war was won. As a lover of sci fi I have read some alternate histories.
Here’s another example: Robert Ferringo’s trilogy: Prayers of the Assassin,Sins of the Assassin,Heart of the Assassin,take place in a alternate America which the north is a Muslim Republic and there is Christian South called the Bible Belt. Another example of Alt history has been written by author Henry Turtletove who wrote a book in which Japanese won World War2. But the best example is the Man in the High Tower by Phillip K Dick which was written over forty years ago. In which Japan and Nazi Germany now control United States.
Now the Man in the High Tower would make an intersting film in my opioin. But there are a lot alternate history fiction out there and it’s not centered in graphic comic novels.
I picked up the graphic “novel” and found it the wretched and incoherent fantasy of some weaselly drug addled half wit. It is pure rubbish but I can tell how the movie will be but the source material is pure rat droppings.
Countdown to Drudge readers telling us that nobody sees movies anymore because of HollyWEIRD’s socialist gay agenda.
5…
4…
3…
“Was this a movie” – your comments about the twin towers show you to be a run of the mill idiot. they were visible from everywhere and were part of the skyline from an officein midtown, from a cemetary across the river, from the harbor. i think what snyder was “trying to say” was that it was fucking 1985.
I too was extremely excited by the trailer but was left cold by the movie. I was shifting in my seat by the end of the first act and it only got more laborious.
‘xerxes’ has a point. 300 was a success due to one line and a whole lot of testosterone. ‘This IS SPARTA!’…that one line of dialogue has more energy than this WHOLE MOVIE.
It’s too bad they couldn’t eliminate a few more subplots. Dr. Manhattan and his journey would be a movie enough, blue wang and all. + Crudup, amongst this group brings some serious chops to the table. It takes skill to create a humanistic and soulful rendering of a naked blue god-man.
Malin is a total fembot and needs to take some more classes. The rest were good but again, very limited in what they could do because of the lack of material. There no emotional connections in this film work caring about except Roarsharch and Dan…which is so so sad.
The biggest intellectual hole in the film is the fact that Snyder doesn’t ever address the social context of WHAT these crazy costumed folk are doing or WHY. Drove me nuts. I kept being reminded of why I loved Kavalier and Klay and so much.
This movie will fall off huge by next weekend and like someone said above, in two years it will be as dusty on the shelf as ‘Mystery Men’.
I’ll take Brett Ratner’s X-men over the Watchman every day of the week.
Which is totally sad and depressing.
how can a movie be both breathtaking and disappointing at the same time?
despite some great moments and performances, parts of it were outright laughable. there was actually a row of dudes behind me laughing at the awkward music cues and at the sex scenes (one of which looked exactly like the one from 300, but without the drama or intensity). i can’t see this movie having legs. Very disappointing aftertaste.
but kudos to the actors, esp. Jackie Earle Haley – he brought it!
RE: Was this a movie?
*****MAJOR SPOILER’S AHEAD******
The “commercial” term was more used to comment on the length of the film, there are many moments that were cut out that exist in the director’s cut/book that would’ve made and ultimately will make the 3rd act & overall film more satisfying. We don’t see the death of Hollis Mason (original Nite Owl) which is one of the things that spur Dan to want to join the investigation. We don’t see the fact that Dr. Manhattan saw Specter & Nite Owl together, which is the event that sent him to Mars. If they made it clear in the beginning that Nite Owl was impotent, the that sex scene later wouldn’t have come off so WTF. You don’t get any real sense of Adrian Veidt (Oxymandias) in the beginning and how much of a humanitarian he was and how much he tried to help (i think he might only be in 4-5 scenes & they ignore his closeted homosexuality though they allude to it later in the film when Nite Owl looks through his computer. the folder marked BOYS), so when it turn out he’s the one behind it, you don’t really care that much, they only really focus on Rorschach, Owl, & Specter. MOST importantly ALL OF THE CHARACTER SUBPLOTS WERE GONE, the newsstand guy & the teenager, the lesbian couple, Rorschach & his prison therapist, ALL of these added up to make you CARE when the bomb went off because you got to know all of the “normal” characters (though they do show show them in the detonation scenes, which lend to my belief that the scenes WERE filmed). The OVERALL reality is that Snyder knew that he couldn’t release a 3hr 20min film, but he SHOT one and released the best possible version that he could. This “commercial” or “theatrical version” is pretty good, he got alot more RIGHT than wrong, but again the real fans of this whole thing are waiting for the Director’s Cut.
i love comic book movies as much as the next geek, but The Dark Knight pushed the time limits being 2.5 hours. Now Watchmen has to go 2 3/4 hours? I just hope it has good flow and some reasonable action sequences to keep me engaged.
I’m all for telling the story right and all, and understand its a complex one to tell, but damn….
oh, and it’s WWE Smackdown, not WWF. it’s only been 8 years since the change.
I had the vaguest interest in the Watchmen…but my friends coming out of it are giving it a thumbs down. I wson’t bother…so I imagine it will crap out from a general public who feels like me.
Good movie, but not great. I enjoyed the sfx, but the violence was way over the top. The gore didn’t add to the story at all, it was gratuitous. The acting was good and everyone liked the big, blue penis.
A solid *** out of five.
WATCHMEN’S BOXOFFICE BURNS BRIGHT.
BUT THE FILM IS A SLOW BUNGLED SIGHT.
WITH CGI TRICKS,
AND OBSESSED WITH BLUE DICKS.
SORRY ZACK, BUT ALAN WAS RIGHT.
What was done right with this adaptation was done well. But what was cut or compromised was not done near as well as it could have been.
Alexander (march 7 10:53): “Watchmen has been the ONLY comic book release since The Dark Knight.”
Punisher: War Zone and The Spirit were both released in December.
Boycott SAG (March 7, 2009 11:38am): “The watchmen was the stupidest movie ever!”
The stupidest movie EVER? I haven’t seen it yet and am in no rush, but I have a hard time envisioning it being the stupidest movie ever when Basic Instinct 2 and the Aqua Teen Hunger Force movie exist.
“This just proves how dumb the audiences are today.”
Are you sure you want to be throwing stones inside that glass house of yours?
Xerxes (March 7, 5:13 pm): “Nobody I know in Hollywood understands why the 300 kicked butt so hard yet, though it’s blatantly obvious to people who live outside the biz, and it isn’t present in any form in Watchmen.”
You think? The impression I got from the trailers was that there’d be plenty of homoerotic imagery in this one, too.
B Hennessay! (March 8, 7:55 am): “It was published as an f-ing comic book, which mo amount of “Greatest Literary Lists” can overcome. Not only are you expecting unitiated women to pick up a comic book for perhaps the first time in their lives, you’re asking them to pick up 12 issues with 4-6 pages of full page text in the back.”
Actually, what AWV seems to be asking/expecting (both of which I think are unrealistic, but he/she said it) them to pick up a large book split into twelve chapters. Outside of a first issue rerelease a month or two ago, the book’s only been widely available in collected form for the better part of 20 years.
I mention this primarily because a lot of people with pretensions to literary taste find the idea of reading a trade paperback “graphic novel” more palatable than a comic book, even if the only difference between the two is what’s holding the spines together.
Nice quote, “how can a movie be both breathtaking and disappointing at the same time?
My child said he enjoyed the graphic novel. He was disappointed I didn’t take him. I’m glad I didn’t. The violence was worse then Fall Out 3, which I enjoyed because it was relevant to the game. The sex scenes well, people had bought their little kids in. This wasn’t the Dark Knight and having to explain the balloon sex will be an interesting conversation on the drive home.
As for the quote from Nikki, it was the weirdest movie I’ve seen in a while. As I drove home I wondered what I had just seen. The music was interesting, especially the time warps. The 99 ballons songs ( 1983) I thought was cool. Act 1 seemed to be the best part of the movie. But how can one have a super hero movie with only a few stunts. Further, the best character was killed off in the opening scene, and the second best character in the third act. WEIRD FING WEIRD, how many sequels can the make out of this comic book.
As someone who had never read the graphic novel, I’ve gotta say I was disappointed in Watchmen. Visually satisfying? Sure. But after I walked out of the movie, I was like, “Okay? And…?”
This is supposed to be the greatest comic/graphic novel of all time? Really?! It just seemed like, okay, I get it, times have changed, super heroes are on the outs, some of them have a hard time getting over it, they’re regular, flawed people, someone’s killing them off, one of them’s in a bad relationship, oh wait, it’s one of their own who’s killing them off…and? What?
Hard to imagine this one staying in the theatres for more than 5 weeks, but I imagine profitability is already assured after this weekend, once you factor in all the ancillary markets.
ps – Jdlso8, relax, it’s the weekend. You have an opinion, it’s valid, we get it. 3 separate posts to a topic – much like Watchmen – seems a little excessive and pointless.
I don’t think this movie will make much money. The fanboys came out, but they are a small demographic group, and the movie seems unable to break out to the wider population. There are not that many (White) young people anymore, and that is who goes to see movies. Recession and lasting fears about jobs/money means people will only go to see movies, or buy DVDs/Blu-Ray discs, when the movie is easy to understand, feel-good, and offers clear heroes and villains with the hero winning in some way.
Madea showed there is an audience for Black-themed films, but they have little cross-over appeal and again, due to demographics that population wont’ drive blockbusters. Latinos/Hispanics have their own, native Spanish-language movies and don’t find Hollywood’s movies, stars, themes, or anything else very appealing, save a few broad-spectrum films like the Batman, Harry Potter, and Spider-Man movies.
The source material (I read it) is not a broadly appealing story. Too many characters, most of the unsympathetic, a situation that is too sci-fi and unrealistic (Nixon brought us Detente, SALT talks, the EPA, relations with China, and Vietnamization, along with Wage-Price controls and Affirmative Action, he was a New Deal Liberal in GOP clothing). There is no central hero the audience/readership roots for and follows. Far too much complication, sub-plots, that only make sense to long-time comics readers who know that say, Ozymandias is “really” “Peter Cannon, Thunderbolt.” Which itself does not make sense, the original character created by NYPD officer (Yes!) Peter Morisi was a gentle martial artist mostly interested in meditating. It’s like turning Barney into a ravenous carnivore eating kids, just because you can, doesn’t mean it makes sense.
Moreover, the broad theme of the movie, that another 9/11 would unify the nation, and the world, has been proven wrong by events. Right after 9/11 so many voices at home and abroad were screaming about why they hated us, or they hated us for our freedom, or other things and unity was nowhere to be found. America and the world was more disunited than ever before.
Using an event, any event, to paper over huge, yawning chasms of disagreement, just does not work, and has been proven not to work within the last 8 years. Moore and Snyder got that so wrong that moviegoers are giving this film bad word of mouth.
Combined with no central hero to root for who wins, there is nothing to make this a blockbuster.
Lesson: being “cool” is one thing, making money is another.
It’s far too easy to slag something off when you know the book inside out. I just saw this in a packed out North London art cinema in Hampstead, home of the rich arty intellectuals and the like, and everyone loved it. No-one left during the show. The audience was 20-45 ish, and almost 50-50 male/female.
There was only one free seat in the cinema. It got aplause at the end. Now, there may be a higher quota of pseuds in this part of North London, but everyone seemed to agree that despite the odd clunky dialogue that didn’t really translate to film, and yes the odd sniggerable moment, the film was STUNNING.
I had a vague memory of the comic (my brother was a fan) which I remember being brilliant and chose NOT to revisit is (how do you translate Alan Moore to screen and not miss anything anyway) – very glad I didn’t – but this was SO atmospheric and beautifully shot,and it’s the closest I’ve felt to reading an Alan Moore graphic novel too in the cinema, which has to be a compliment. Stop hating on the film fanboys.
Oh, and I’m female, 30, and an ex model. Hope that breaks the mould a bit.
I feel like I should ask permission here before fessing up to liking the film. What’s up with all the snarkiness and biting?
Maybe I was just so terribly, terribly disappointed in THE SPIRIT that I needed to love WATCHMEN, I dunno… but I had a marvelous two hours and forty minutes.
“I have yet to find a woman who knows of it (past any imagery), much less expressed interest in seeing it.”
Yeesh, guy, what kind of women do you know?
“This is an R rated dude film.”
And women never, ever see movies like that, right?
I rarely read comic books, but I’ve read Watchmen and really enjoyed it. The movie was an almost too-faithful adaptation in that it didn’t cut enough out to pick up the pace (e.g., we didn’t need to learn about Rorshach’s past and the Silk Spectre subplot was too truncated to add anything).
I also wonder how much it suffered from being dated. I doubt most teens today understand the image of Nixon, what he represents, and all the fear about nuclear war. I’m in my mid-30’s, and I had to work to understand the implicit references.
But I’m still glad it was made and that I got to see it on IMAX.
People rejoice!
Watchmen Smatchmen. The real news is The Jonas Brothers crashed and burned!
There is hope for humanity yet.
The box office numbers do not worry me; I predict this movie will make a shitload of c-notes on DVD/Blue Ray. All of the fanboys want that version. I know there’s at least 45 minutes of movie, along with the faux ‘Under the Hood’ documentary and ‘Tale of the Black Freighter’ animated short. According the Snyder, it will all be edited together for an ‘Absolute Watchmen’ DVD.
That’s where the money is at.
I will say, I do agree that it was too short. I wish the WB had the foresight to let Snyder shoot a five/six hour movie and split it into two parts — a la Kill Bill or Lord of the Rings.
@intellektual eleet – You might break the mould (or mold) in the best of ways. Like a model it was indeed stunning to look at…but also like a model it was cold, emotionless, untouchable and distant…
But I’m just saying…
The comments here are an interesting discussion of what makes a good movie, and what ruins a movie. The major observations seem to be absolutely spot-on when adapting a book/novel/graphic novel to a film:
1. Familiarity with the source material
2. Respect for the source material
3. Keeping the story “tight” without shortchanging the plot
4. Overuse of style versus substance (this includes wondrous CGI and other special effects)
5. Over-hyping the film
Indeed, it seemed to me that the marketing department at Warner Brothers seem to understand the graphic novel better than Snyder understood it.
@ intellektuwal eleet:
Re: ‘odd sniggerable moment’
Tsk. Hey babe, just a note. On this side of the pond we practice political correctness. Your use of the term ’sniggerable’ might be …uh, misunderstood. In the future you might use the less objectionable variant
‘odd snAfrican-Americanable’ moment.
@ whiskey – you missed the point. it’s not the attack in new york that unites everyone/brings about world peace. it is the fear of a vengeful god (dr. manhattan). if people knew for a fact that there was a higher being watching, might they behave more? that’s the central point here.
WEIRD FING WEIRD, how many sequels can the make out of this comic book.
None. Please.
I think the weekend gross is extremely disappointing because Warner has been promoting this movie for more than a year! And $50 million is all it grossed!
However, I also blame Warner Bros. The marketing campaign tells you nothing about what the movie is about. As some people have pointed out, the studio seems to be concealing the main plot point that someone is killing the superheroes. Instead, you get a lot of flashy visual effects in the commercials, but if you haven’t read the graphic novel, you don’t know what the visuals mean.
The whole subtext of the Watchmen story is that the superheroes are actually killing themselves, one way or another, whether through their own psychological damage or by actual homicide.
By marketing this as just a superhero flick with stunning graphics, Warner is creating false expectations. As someone commented earlier, the audience is going in expecting an X-Men kind of film (get it X-Men/Watchmen – similar names) and they’re getting a twisted, film noir detective story. It’s not what they expect. They’re not prepared for the darkness and the horror.
It reminds me of how Universal botched the marketing of Serenity. The studio had radio ads comparing it to Star Wars and the TV commercials likewise gave no indication of the movie’s plot. I know I blew off the film totally because of the marketing and it wasn’t until I later caught the DVD that I found it had been the best sci-fi film of the year.
I think the Warner folks didn’t understand the film, or had no clue on how to market something challenging, and they just gave it the standard generic “visually stunning” marketing treatment which often fails to bring in audiences on these mega-budgeted pictures.
the point spread of this game will be — oh wait, wrong website..
We’ve seen fanboy hype do this before – build a film to impossible expectations. Watchmen has always polarized, why should we expect the film to be different. There’s no strong central character or moral imperative. That’s why it doesn’t do it for me. I prefer stuff like the online Pyramids of Mars, but lots of others really, really like Moore’s creation.
Just saw it on Sunday, and was pleasantly surprised. Some beautiful images – very high production quality. Liked the honest nudity and a lot of the ideas.
That being said, I was never sure what the message was supposed to be. It seemed to contradict itself several times, and at the end you’re not sure what the whole thing was about. Also, the Nixon timeline really confused me – even with a third term he would have still only been President in the Seventies – but the plot kept referring to the Eighties, which had NOTHING to do with Nixon or the Cold War or Vietnam.
Still, a lot of care obviously went into making the movie, and it showed.
Fan of the source material. Like the movie more than I expected. I think it’s about as close an adaptation as you can hope for and still have an effective film. Some bits were awkward. Some omitted elements were missed. But the things it got right (and there are a number of them), I think it did really well.
It’s hard to see some people tearing it down because it’s not a typical superhero story. Or because they can’t tell the bad guys from the good guys. All I can say to that is — that’s kind of the point. If you don’t like it, fine. But you can’t criticize a film for not delivering something it’s not promising in the first place. The error was in your expectations. Next time, try being more open-minded.
I do think the box office predictions were unrealistic, partly due to the running time (fewer screenings per screen per day) and because it didn’t have the benefit of opening on one of those 4.5 day holiday “weekends” like so many other event pics.
It’s not the greatest film ever made nor is it the worst. And it’s not as grand as the source material. But for what it is and what it’s trying to be, it’s good. Certainly as good as or better than a lot of stuff I’ve seen in the last year.
@Maryland re: some of your confusion
– I’m not sure why you say the Cold War has nothing to do with the Eighties, which were all about Reagan, Gorbachev, SDI, and the fall of the Berlin Wall.
- Re: Nixon’s terms — One character (Hollis Mason) specifically mentions voting for Nixon “five times.”
- As for Vietnam, those scenes take place in 1971, as stated by another character (Doctor Manhattan).
@watchfan: “If you don’t like it, fine. But you can’t criticize a film for not delivering something it’s not promising in the first place. The error was in your expectations”
I agree…but WB marketing did the general audience no favors by marketing it as a regular superhero movie.
I knew what I was in for and just didn’t care for it. The movie had no life, it was a very elaborate and nicely illustrated Powerpoint of the graphic novel. Zach Snyder nailed the text perfectly, but he forgot to bring the Sub-text to his adaptation.
@informedviewer — Your point about marketing is well taken, but I’d submit that that type of bait-and-switch is typical of almost all movies and campaigns these days. Particularly event ones. They pull a shotgun technique to try to spin and contort the film so as to appeal to all demos solely to post those all-important first weekend numbers.
The prevailing mentality seems to be that it’s not just accepted, but expected, to try to dupe as many people into showing up before anyone really knows what the piece is about. And I think that that notion is as important as overall quality of the film when charting the second weekend drop-off.
I’ll say one thing in favor of Watchmen marketing, the spots I saw really didn’t try to reduce the plot to a simple, trailer-friendly typical superhero story sound byte. Everything I saw was all about setting a mood and establishing an interesting ensemble — but maybe those are just the bits that played on the channels/shows I watch.
I still remember the Revenge of the Sith campaign with some spots that played it as non-stop lightsaber battles, others that focused on the epic tragedy of Vader, and still others that painted it as a grand romance between Anakin and Padme.
I saw Watchmen this weekend. Totally sucked eggs. The trailers looked good, the CGI was good, but everything else sucked. Absolutely positively one of the worst movies I have seen. THe storyline was so chopped up. character development was over half the movie. If they wanted to do it right, they should have split it into several movies. I will not see it again. And my friends have the same view. There are two kinds of people that would enjoy this movie. #1 fanboys who have no comprehension of reality. and #2 Meat gazers…
Isn’t the film basically about how absolute power corrupts, even superheroes. Dr. Manhattan was the only one with real powers and he became detached and uninvolved with humanity and was thus manipulated into providing the “villain” the means to use him as a scapegoat. The others were variously corrupted by their own desires and ambitions. Some simply went away and became ordinary, but really wanted more, while say the Comedian continued to be his own degenerate self throughout his life until it was too late.
““Really? I have yet to find a woman who knows of it (past any imagery), much less expressed interest in seeing it. This is an R rated dude film.”
You cannot be serious. Any woman with literary chops has read it and is at least curious about a movie adaptation. Watchmen is one of the single most important works of the 20th Century, not just some fanboy wank. I admit to being nervous that Hollywood would ruin it, but I was pleased with the film, and so were most of my 30-something female peers.”
Comment by apparently without vagina
just wanted to stand with vagina regarding that douchebag’s comments above. I went with several female friends (all smart, well-read–all had read the watchmen before) and we all liked it. It was actually better than I thought it would be.
I also concur with those above–I had people asking me whether their kid would like this “superhero” movie and I all but choked at their idiocy before realizing they were just going off of marketing & had no idea this movie was probably too dark for even them, let alone their kids. I guess marketing didn’t like, “morbidly depressing, graphic, softcore, conceptual parody of the “superhero” story–posing the question whether humans are even worth saving.”
Bunch of dicks.
To XY – why the name calling? I stand by what _I_ said: it isn’t a chick flick and I don’t know many who are interested in seeing it.
Sorry, but not all people are “just like you.”